The man with the golden blood • Hacker News Board

Re: The man with the golden blood

#41

Post by masklinn » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:00 PM UTC

niels_olson wrote: post #30

gwern wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's modern medical 'ethics' for you: damn the consequences, what matters is what it looks like and whether it offends anyone.

No, it's about the safety of the blood supply. It's a weird quirk of human psychology and economics that paying for donations means fewer healthy people and more people with infectious diseases donate when it's fee-for-blood.

For an example of that, HIV likely crossed into the US from Haiti via the blood trade[0][1] which acted as both amplifier and transport after haitians had to leave DRC, and some got infected in the time they spent there.

And of course thousands of haemophiliacs in the 80s got infected with HIV and HepC because of contaminated Factor VIII: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contaminated_haemophilia_blood_...

[0] http://www.onereads.org/spillover-david-quammen?page=0,208

[1] http://lambsbloodblog.wordpress.com/2013/01/11/hemo-caribbea...

Re: The man with the golden blood

#42

Post by niels_olson » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:01 PM UTC

psykovsky wrote: post #38

Osmium wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two other possibilities: * In the private health-care world, if you're getting paid, you might feel like someone else is profiting off your blood (how else could they pay you?) or * In the public health-care world, if you're getting paid you might feel like money is being ill-spent when it could/should be used to better pay healthcare workers etc. since people are typically willing to donate blood for free.

Except, in most cases you donate the blood to a blood bank that will sell it to wherever it is needed. The blood banks are profiting from your blood and hospitals are ill-spending money. You get the worse of both worlds.

It costs money to keep the lights on and pay employees, refrigeration, databases, transportation (we get blood shipped from ARC three hours away twice a day), etc. And if you're not making money, you're losing money. Money is how societies manage these costs. Most blood banks are associated with a hospital or university. Some centers are free standing, like Blood Source or American Red Cross (ARC), and they are often the ones doing the heavy lifting: managing rare units, sending 100 units of platelets to a disaster zone, etc.

On the flip side, blood banking is a small community. Each chief blood banker knows how much the products cost, often from working on both sides of the transaction at various times in their careers, and they see each other regularly. The head of our blood bank was previously the head of Blood Source. She has obligations to the university to not waste money, and she knows how much it costs to get a unit from Blood Source.

Re: The man with the golden blood

#43

Post by joezydeco » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:02 PM UTC

niels_olson wrote: post #27

csdrane wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would have guessed that the reason for prohibiting payment for blood would be the same as the reason prohibiting payment for organ donations. Interesting that in this case it is blamed on trying to minimize donations from people with HIV.

It's not just HIV. It's any infectious disease (there is a thick book of reasons to disallow a donation). The problem is that these infectious diseases are socially disruptive, therefore these folk, unfortunately, tend to have less marginal income. Therefore, they are exactly the people who would respond to a small monetary incentive. This has been studied. If anyone is acutely aware of the problem, it's blood banks.…

I'm advocating tax deductions as an incentive.

If I give $350 in cash to the American Red Cross, I can take that charitable deduction from my annual filing. If I donate a unit of blood that gives ARC $350 in products, that's not deductible.

The incentive side steps the donor-with-marginal-income problem, unless I'm missing something.

Re: The man with the golden blood

#44

Post by Osmium » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:05 PM UTC

psykovsky wrote: post #38

Osmium wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Two other possibilities: * In the private health-care world, if you're getting paid, you might feel like someone else is profiting off your blood (how else could they pay you?) or * In the public health-care world, if you're getting paid you might feel like money is being ill-spent when it could/should be used to better pay healthcare workers etc. since people are typically willing to donate blood for free.

Except, in most cases you donate the blood to a blood bank that will sell it to wherever it is needed. The blood banks are profiting from your blood and hospitals are ill-spending money. You get the worse of both worlds.

Not necessarily. This isn't the case in the UK (where I am) for example, where blood donations are taken by the NHS.

Re: The man with the golden blood

#45

Post by MrJagil » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

wffurr wrote: post #36

MrJagil wrote: post #22

What an amazing reading experience. So rarely do you see an article with so few distractions. I wish I had something substantial to add, but I was just in awe by the presentation, the clear-cut contact information and credentials laid out, the pleasant font choices and how the related stories weren't pushed on you as opportunities for ad-rev, but for enlightenment for the curious.

I was highly distracted by the nonessential photos of bagged blood, which I found super creepy.

Yeah, in the bottom it says "name changed" so I assume the anonymity resulted in an overdose of stock photos.

Re: The man with the golden blood

#46

Post by [deleted] » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:10 PM UTC

davegardner wrote: post #24

TheBeardKing wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would think they could just screen frequent donors with rare blood types for infections. Once the donor is known safe, compensate however is needed to get their blood. I believe there are private industries doing this. This one will be opening soon in my town, though I guess just for plasma: http://www.biolifeplasma.com/become-donor/compensation.html

I'm a regular whole blood and plasma donor and I'm quite sure that I'd be much less likely to donate if I was being paid for it. I'm not really sure exactly why I feel that way, but I guess that if you put a dollar value on it I'd be calculating whether it really was worth my time. Right now, because there is no compensation (aside from a muffin and a cup of tea afterwards), I get the emotional benefits of having per…

[deleted]

Re: The man with the golden blood

#47

Post by mrfusion » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:23 PM UTC

IvyMike wrote: post #26

Most people who donate blood just go into a pool, but 'directed' blood donations are very interesting. I found out about directed donation when someone I know was found to be a close match for a baby with Diamond Blackfan anemia. He was asked if he would do directed blood donations to that baby on a regular basis. It was a serious commitment; missing a donation would put the child's life in danger. There were additio…

I get a postcard whenever they use my donated blood. I wonder how that works, does everyone in a given pool get the postcard?

Re: The man with the golden blood

#48

Post by IvyMike » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:35 PM UTC

mrfusion wrote: post #47

IvyMike wrote: post #26

Most people who donate blood just go into a pool, but 'directed' blood donations are very interesting. I found out about directed donation when someone I know was found to be a close match for a baby with Diamond Blackfan anemia. He was asked if he would do directed blood donations to that baby on a regular basis. It was a serious commitment; missing a donation would put the child's life in danger. There were additio…

I get a postcard whenever they use my donated blood. I wonder how that works, does everyone in a given pool get the postcard?

Just to be clear: when I said "pool", they don't like, blend the blood--I just meant that your bag of blood is available for general usage. They can and do track individual packs.

Regarding the postcard: I have donated in Illinois and California and have never gotten one. But I haven't been able to donate for a few years now because of trips into malaria zones, so if this is a recent thing, that would explain it.

Re: The man with the golden blood

#49

Post by tnorthcutt » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:41 PM UTC

masklinn wrote: post #20

nicholassmith wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's possibly slightly unfair that he's not allowed his own 'stash', but he can only donate a certain amount per year and it seems like it's in demand, and apparently it can only be stored for 42 days (according to a very quick Google search).

> It's possibly slightly unfair that he's not allowed his own 'stash' He is allowed his own stash. > it can only be stored for 42 days Fresh blood can be kept 42 days at 4C, blood can also be frozen and kept for decades (at -80C) or more (virtually indefinitely at -196C) but thawed blood must be used within 48h .

He is allowed his own stash.

Source? The article seemed to indicate that he must permit any blood he donates to be used for other people, thereby implying he may not reserve any of it for himself.

Re: The man with the golden blood

#50

Post by guard-of-terra » Wed, Oct 22, 2014, 5:47 PM UTC

I wonder if it's possible to create a blood-producing machine (with bone marrow culture and whatnot).

And then by manipulating its genetic code slightly make it produce whatever blood we want. Better yet, take a sample from one perfect donor and make golden blood at a scale.