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The Lyme Wars (2013)

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Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#21

Post by ep103 »

fasteo wrote: post #16
gkop wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also accurately describes the deer overpopulation in Pennsylvania, where there is also rampant lyme disease. In Pennsylvania, the deer hunters really enjoy the status quo, because of the good odds they can bag a buck every year. And because the hunters have some political influence, proposals to reduce the deer population go nowhere. I'm not sure if the political landscape is similar in New England.

Looking at this from the outside, it seems to me that deer hunters are more likely to get lyme disease and so, they should favor deer population control.

If you're just going out into the woods for a day, its relatively easy to stay safe. You wear certain types of clothes, tuck them into each other a certain way, spray yourself with tick repellent, come home, throw them immediately into the wash, and then shower and check your body.

Ticks are much more difficult for children (who have to be taught the above), definitely people with outdoor pets, people who didn't expect to be in the woods (gardening, picnics, shortcut on the walk home, etc), and people not returning for the night (ever try checking yourself for ticks by firelight? even then your laundry is nearby, and they might crawl out. etc)

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#22

Post by eric_h »

ckinnan wrote: post #8

Lyme is now the number one infectious disease in New England. Until medical science finds an effective cure, the best solution is to hunt deer populations back down to historical and sustainable levels, around 10 or 15 deer per square mile. (current populations approach 60 deer per square mile in some areas). While mice are the most important reservoir for Lyme (and pass it to humans via tick nymphs), the adult black…

I'm a fan of reintroducing wolves - they used to keep the deer population in check.

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#23

Post by mrfusion »

It's funny, there's actually a vaccine [1]. It's amazing we're not getting it out there:

> In 1998 SmithKline Beecham (now GlaxoSmithKline) developed a vaccine that was about 80 percent effective for at least a year after three doses.

[1] http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/19/opinion/bring-back-the-lym...

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#25

Post by mrfusion »

amluto wrote: post #17

I'm surprised that the article doesn't mention LYMERix, the FDA-licensed vaccine that seems to be a casualty of anti-vaccine hysteria and a somewhat overzealous legal system. There seems to be a tiny suggestion that the vaccine might cause some issues, but all the studies seem to show that this isn't a problem. Also, vaccinating dogs against Lyme disease is standard practice, and it doesn't seem to hurt the dogs. Her…

Can humans use the dog vaccine? Perhaps a black market might develop?

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#26

Post by gamache »

Kenji wrote: post #9

I had Lyme disease and I started having symptoms (but no rash) roughly after 1-2 weeks after the tick bite (feeling unwell, shivering, joint pains, swollen lymph nodes). I then took antibiotics for almost 2 weeks. I continued to have severe joint pain for a couple of months. Now, more than a year later, I am feeling well, but sometimes I still feel a very slight joint pain in those affected joints near that tick bite…

I found a deer tick on myself earlier this summer. Even though it is "not possible" that I was infected in the 12-24 hours it was attached, I insisted on treatment. Three weeks of amoxicillin is not that bad. Chronic Lyme is. I had to advocate for myself in this matter, and I recommend anyone in my position do the same.

I was also treated for initial-stage Lyme about ten years ago, quite successfully, although I developed Bell's Palsy and lost the use of half my face for a few days. That was interesting. Lyme is garbage.

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#27

Post by ckinnan »

XFrequentist wrote: post #15
ckinnan wrote: post #8

Lyme is now the number one infectious disease in New England. Until medical science finds an effective cure, the best solution is to hunt deer populations back down to historical and sustainable levels, around 10 or 15 deer per square mile. (current populations approach 60 deer per square mile in some areas). While mice are the most important reservoir for Lyme (and pass it to humans via tick nymphs), the adult black…

My understanding is that deer are required for long-distance transport of black legged tick populations, but are not absolutely required to complete the full two-year life cycle.

Nope. "Even though adult ticks can feed on other mammals such as dogs, cats and raccoons, the female adult tick requires a blood meal from the deer before she can lay her 2,000 to 6,000 eggs." http://www.deeralliance.com/node/10

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#28

Post by cjcole »

mrfusion wrote: post #24

Does anyone know why we don't develop an immunity to lyme disease after being infected once?

I was diagnosed with and treated for Lyme a few years ago.

At the time, my physician mentioned that a previous infection would provide "a limited immunity" (exact quote).

Since then, I've had two bulls-eyes but no symptoms (oblig anecdata).

It appears that you develop an immunity only to particular strains of the bug:

http://iai.asm.org/content/early/2014/01/07/IAI.01451-13

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#29

Post by ckinnan »

fasteo wrote: post #16
gkop wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This also accurately describes the deer overpopulation in Pennsylvania, where there is also rampant lyme disease. In Pennsylvania, the deer hunters really enjoy the status quo, because of the good odds they can bag a buck every year. And because the hunters have some political influence, proposals to reduce the deer population go nowhere. I'm not sure if the political landscape is similar in New England.

Looking at this from the outside, it seems to me that deer hunters are more likely to get lyme disease and so, they should favor deer population control.

Talking to a lot of hunters, many don't recognize the Lyme threat, since it is a relatively new phenomenon, especially outside of New England. I also suspect that many outdoor people have been exposed to Lyme and don't know it, just had a "summer flu". Finally, hunting season (Oct to Dec) isn't a high risk time-- only larger adult ticks are active in October and never active when temps go below 40 degrees.

Re: The Lyme Wars (2013)

#30

Post by cjcole »

gamache wrote: post #26
Kenji wrote: post #9

I had Lyme disease and I started having symptoms (but no rash) roughly after 1-2 weeks after the tick bite (feeling unwell, shivering, joint pains, swollen lymph nodes). I then took antibiotics for almost 2 weeks. I continued to have severe joint pain for a couple of months. Now, more than a year later, I am feeling well, but sometimes I still feel a very slight joint pain in those affected joints near that tick bite…

I found a deer tick on myself earlier this summer. Even though it is "not possible" that I was infected in the 12-24 hours it was attached, I insisted on treatment. Three weeks of amoxicillin is not that bad. Chronic Lyme is. I had to advocate for myself in this matter, and I recommend anyone in my position do the same. I was also treated for initial-stage Lyme about ten years ago, quite successfully, although I deve…

I'm sitting here with an angry-looking bulls-eye from a tick (scapularis) that was attached for less than 12 hours. (It wasn't there when I went to bed and was there when I woke up.)

With a previous infection I was eventually unable to walk without crutches and had such intense jaw pain that I couldn't sleep without a mouth guard. This is a nasty bug and not to be trifled with.

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