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How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

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Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#11

Post by tdicola »

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #2

Colorado, probably. Washington, not yet. The Washington Liquor Control Board, in its infinite wisdom, only authorized about 25% of the total amount of legal pot-growing necessary to satisfy demand in the state, which means that the black market here in Washington is still flourishing: http://www.thestranger.com/slog/archives/2014/07/08/how-wash... Thankfully, it sounds like the LCB started changing its tune about pot…

There were also some pretty big gaffes with the lottery process to allow the first stores to open. There was very little vetting of the participants and as a result many of the people who got picked were completely unprepared to open and run a retail business. Companies with experience and money to get a store open lost out to people who just wanted to put their name in the hat and have no intention or real capability of opening a store.

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#13

Post by guard-of-terra »

lukifer wrote: post #7
lisper wrote: post #3

The U.S. has done the prohibition experiment twice now, and it was an unmitigated disaster both times. The data are unambiguous: prohibition doesn't work, never has, never will. And yet we're still arguing about it. Funny thing, though, we've done a similar experiment with tax cuts for the wealthy three times now: once in the 1920's, once starting in the 1980s, and most recently in Kansas. The results have been simil…

Alcohol prohibition is an apt historical lesson, especially regarding violence and black markets, but there is a significant difference: the intended targets. Alcohol was outlawed primarily to target men, particularly the violent and alcoholic, and was a stand-in for women's issues. It was the first time domestic violence began to be (indirectly) talked about, and was a major driver for women's suffrage and activism.…

"Cannabis prohibition, on the other hand, has historically been targeted explicitly at minorities"

In the USA. And the rest of the world inherited that for free. Which is kind of sad actually, living by other people ideosyncrasies.

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#14

Post by [deleted] »

lisper wrote: post #3

The U.S. has done the prohibition experiment twice now, and it was an unmitigated disaster both times. The data are unambiguous: prohibition doesn't work, never has, never will. And yet we're still arguing about it. Funny thing, though, we've done a similar experiment with tax cuts for the wealthy three times now: once in the 1920's, once starting in the 1980s, and most recently in Kansas. The results have been simil…

[deleted]

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#15

Post by jakejake »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #12

I wonder if the names of people who put Marijuana in the strictest schedule of various laws and agreements are known. I think someone should dig them up, so the world can know its heroes by name.

There's a lot of interesting names here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#16

Post by dragontamer »

lukifer wrote: post #7
lisper wrote: post #3

The U.S. has done the prohibition experiment twice now, and it was an unmitigated disaster both times. The data are unambiguous: prohibition doesn't work, never has, never will. And yet we're still arguing about it. Funny thing, though, we've done a similar experiment with tax cuts for the wealthy three times now: once in the 1920's, once starting in the 1980s, and most recently in Kansas. The results have been simil…

Alcohol prohibition is an apt historical lesson, especially regarding violence and black markets, but there is a significant difference: the intended targets. Alcohol was outlawed primarily to target men, particularly the violent and alcoholic, and was a stand-in for women's issues. It was the first time domestic violence began to be (indirectly) talked about, and was a major driver for women's suffrage and activism.…

"Cannabis prohibition, on the other hand, has historically been targeted explicitly at minorities"

Note: targeted at minorities by minorities.

The African American community was hugely supportive of the "War on Drugs", until it became clear that it wasn't helping.

But seriously, in the 1960s through 1990s, plenty of powerful African American politicians supported the War on Drugs. http://prisontime.org/files/2013/07/oberia-dempsey-war-on-dr... . The "War on Drugs" was built with huge support from the African American community, we Americans as a whole thought it would be good for us.

It was believed that the white man oppressed African Americans through the use of drugs. Therefore, by declaring the war on drugs, the Black man would become freer. Things didn't turn out that way :-(

Today, the "War on Drugs" is clearly not helping. Eric Holder / President Obama ordered the FBI / Justice Department to go easier against drug offenders.

So it is clear to our current leaders (as well as African American leaders) that we need to end the "War on Drugs".

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#17

Post by guard-of-terra »

jakejake wrote: post #15
guard-of-terra wrote: post #12

I wonder if the names of people who put Marijuana in the strictest schedule of various laws and agreements are known. I think someone should dig them up, so the world can know its heroes by name.

There's a lot of interesting names here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937

It's interesting that it was introduced by a Dem. I think there should be a move that Dem formally apologise for this law - or all the weed smokers no longer vote for them and they become unelectable.

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#18

Post by jMyles »

lisper wrote: post #5
canjobear wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is not unambiguous that Prohibition didn't work. http://www.nber.org/papers/w3675.pdf Whether or not it was worth the cost is a separate issue; I think it's pretty clear that it wasn't. But the argument can be made that it did "work" in reducing alcohol consumption.

I didn't say that it didn't work , I said it was an unmitigated disaster . A program can achieve its ostensible goals and still be disastrous. Jim Crow "worked" too.

Of course alcohol prohibition didn't even achieve its ostensible goal of eliminating alcohol from the American diet. Whether it reduced consumption at all (by volume of alcohol) is in dispute. There's no dispute that it lead to consumption of stronger beverages, in the same way that poppy prohibition has eliminated the use of poppy tea (an utterly benign preparation) in favor of heroin and even stronger drugs.

As for Jim Crow 'working,' it's notable that drug prohibition has 'worked' as a Jim Crow as well.

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#19

Post by jMyles »

dragontamer wrote: post #16
lukifer wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Alcohol prohibition is an apt historical lesson, especially regarding violence and black markets, but there is a significant difference: the intended targets. Alcohol was outlawed primarily to target men, particularly the violent and alcoholic, and was a stand-in for women's issues. It was the first time domestic violence began to be (indirectly) talked about, and was a major driver for women's suffrage and activism.…

"Cannabis prohibition, on the other hand, has historically been targeted explicitly at minorities" Note: targeted at minorities by minorities. The African American community was hugely supportive of the "War on Drugs", until it became clear that it wasn't helping. But seriously, in the 1960s through 1990s, plenty of powerful African American politicians supported the War on Drugs. http://prisontime.org/files/2013/07/…

Cannabis prohibition, starting right from the 1914 El Paso ordinance, unambiguously and often transparently targeted Mexicans.

You are talking about a much later stage, when the power dynamic was one of entrenched power.

Re: How marijuana legalization in Colorado and Washington is making the world better

#20

Post by dllthomas »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #17
jakejake wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a lot of interesting names here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marihuana_Tax_Act_of_1937

It's interesting that it was introduced by a Dem. I think there should be a move that Dem formally apologise for this law - or all the weed smokers no longer vote for them and they become unelectable.

The nature of both parties have changed substantially since the 30s, no current legislators of either party were involved in government when that bill was passed, and both parties have had ample opportunities to correct the mistake. Holding current Democrats disproportionately responsible is myopic. Refusal to vote for politicians of any party who are on the wrong side of this issue is another matter, for anyone who views it as the most important issue ("weed smoker" or not).
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