Mods, how about resetting this title?
Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
41–50 of 57 posts
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#42Add an indicator that the app is running, and add some language in the description that directly (not just indirectly) addresses the policy. Re-submit and build up a new reputation. Yes, that sucks. The entire "we'll take 30% of your money but you can't talk to a real person and we won't tell you how we interpret your app in terms of our rules" is ludicrous. In the U.S. the market is supposed to bring forth more deve…
I have the persistent notification already. Android lets you remove the notification, so I made it easier for non-savvy people to hide it. I guess I'll take out the easy button, though my competitors all have it. Also, I'll send an email to EVERY registered account on the device when it is set up, instead of only the one they pick. That will make it even harder to use this for spying on someone who doesn't specifical…
> I guess I'll take out the easy button
More than that, you need to make the persistent notification unremovable.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#43Why is this still a problem? Ultimately, because we treat mobile devices as somehow different from PCs, and we expect different things out of their users.
A PC user is expected to understand that there is a certain risk involved with downloading and installing a random program. We warn them, provide them with scanning software, etc., but at the end of the day, we leave the choice in their hands.
A mobile device user is expected to be an abject moron who willy-nilly clicks on links and installs "apps" because "apps" aren't "programs" [0]. So we curate and control what "apps" to which they have access, supposedly in their best interests, supposedly fairly, supposedly blocking out the bad stuff.
Neither assumption is, of course, either incorrect or correct. We should expect users to understand the risks of installing software, as much as we should expect them to understand the risks of inviting a stranger into their homes [1].
But at the same time, users are god damn idiots. It shouldn't be so easy to tap-tap-tap install a program from who knows whom that has been recast as an "app" and thus disassociated from the notion of "program" that they might already know shouldn't be installed without trust.
App stores need to either shit or get off the pot. If you're going to claim a curated app store, then curate the apps already. Either they are a curated means of acquiring programs, and thus can be completely trusted, or they are not, in which case they need to dump the concept that they are "official" or "certified". This post-hoc nonsense is bullshit.
[0] I do know people who don't think of web apps as "downloading" anything, and don't think of smartphone apps as the same thing as "programs". And I very much believe it to be an intentional bit of marketing on behalf of the operating system vendors to encourage people to prop up a nascent app market.
[1] Well, it is worse. You'll probably not be burned by letting every random stranger you ever meet into your house. But of those same people, one of them might be a software MBA, and concerning your computer, he sees it more as his property than yours.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#44Google web history. Pot. Kettle. Black. Would agree with other comments though that the external sending of report to third party email address is likely the cause. Making reporting solely related to the current user may help your case.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#45Why is this still a problem? Ultimately, because we treat mobile devices as somehow different from PCs, and we expect different things out of their users. A PC user is expected to understand that there is a certain risk involved with downloading and installing a random program. We warn them, provide them with scanning software, etc., but at the end of the day, we leave the choice in their hands. A mobile device user…
On PC you download random software from the software makers website, not from a Google or Apple site. Now, if you are downloading something from the Google play store, that implies some form of responsibility by Google. Google is being careful to stop some people from saying "I got a virus from Google!!! They are evil!!!", and similar things.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#46from the appeal: "My app helps people avoid pornography by monitoring their actions and reporting those actions to the person they specify" from the features list: "...is hard to circumvent...", "option to remove the icon in the status bar", "Accountability partners are notified if you ever disable the app". it's straight up spyware. it doesn't help you "avoid pornography" by blocking it like you would do if you actu…
Spyware is typically unknown to the user, hence the word "spy". In this case, the developer is 100% transparent and users are paying for these features. Tracking and accountability are accurate descriptions here.
Google's spyware policy is crystal clear that "Apps that track device user behavior must present users with a full-time persistent notification and icon that clearly identifies the app."
This deliberately violated that policy, and promoted the feature (disabling the notification) that violates the policy.
It clearly was spyware as defined by the Google policy.
Incidentally, pretty much every page of the Ever Accountable website also contains violations of the Android Brand Guidelines [1] with regard to the use of the Android and Google Play trademarks.
[1] http://developer.android.com/distribute/tools/promote/brand....
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#47People should be able to install whatever software on their computers they want. "What if so-and-so grabs such-and-such's phone and installs it?" Well, the same thing applies to my PC. A lot of opsec goes out the window with physical access. Put a passcode on your phone.
> People should be able to install whatever software on their computers they want.
And Android supports sideloading apps.
OTOH, that doesn't obligate Google Play to allow any software you want to sell into their store, especially when it violates black and white terms associated with the use of the store.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#48Why is this still a problem? Ultimately, because we treat mobile devices as somehow different from PCs, and we expect different things out of their users. A PC user is expected to understand that there is a certain risk involved with downloading and installing a random program. We warn them, provide them with scanning software, etc., but at the end of the day, we leave the choice in their hands. A mobile device user…
On PC you download random software from the software makers website, not from a Google or Apple site. Now, if you are downloading something from the Google play store, that implies some form of responsibility by Google. Google is being careful to stop some people from saying "I got a virus from Google!!! They are evil!!!", and similar things.
Right, that is the point I'm trying to make.
That is the statement they are making, but it's not the reality. There is a lot of what can only be described by reasonable people as malware in all of the app stores. They are not curated at all. It just happens that sometimes, an app has a complaint against it and an investigation leads to the app getting banned. That's what I mean by the post-hoc system they employ.
And let's not even get into the issues of quality or uniqueness. How many freaking compass apps do you really need?
If you're going to limit free, open installations, and market to users a curated ecosystem, then curate the apps already. Create a review board. No app goes published without human eyes overlooking it. I don't care that it will reduce the number of approved apps (or the maximum approval rate). That's the entire freaking point. Curate the apps already.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#49People should be able to install whatever software on their computers they want. "What if so-and-so grabs such-and-such's phone and installs it?" Well, the same thing applies to my PC. A lot of opsec goes out the window with physical access. Put a passcode on your phone.
> People should be able to install whatever software on their computers they want. And Android supports sideloading apps. OTOH, that doesn't obligate Google Play to allow any software you want to sell into their store, especially when it violates black and white terms associated with the use of the store.
I don't so much have a problem with the Play store culling out certain violating apps. I'd just prefer it that they do an honest, real job of it[0]. Either curate the system or make it open. What we have now are non-open systems that are not actually all that curated.
[0] And that's slightly separate from whether or not non-app store programs are installable. But I do think that Apple and Google have explicitly attempted to discourage and obfuscate any process for doing so, even so far as to call into question who truly owns the device, you or the corporation.
Re: Google play removed my productivity tracking app for spying
#50People should be able to install whatever software on their computers they want. "What if so-and-so grabs such-and-such's phone and installs it?" Well, the same thing applies to my PC. A lot of opsec goes out the window with physical access. Put a passcode on your phone.
> People should be able to install whatever software on their computers they want
Yep, agreed. But unless I'm missing something, Google is not preventing you from installing whatever apps you want on your handheld computer. , the fellow who started this thread, is free to distribute the .apk file for his app via his own site. (Apple, on the other hand, forbids it.)
In fact, Google tells you how to do this: "you can make them available for download on your own website or server... An easy and quick way to release your apps is to send them to users by email... you can distribute your apps through any app marketplace you want or use multiple marketplaces..." http://developer.android.com/distribute/tools/open-distribut...
And when I've been working on Recent.io, it's a lot easier to distribute to early testers on Android vs. iOS. Simply add someone to a Google Group/G+ group vs. TestFlight, must open in Mail app, provisioning profiles, recompiling, re-uploading, why doesn't this version work, I hit my 100-user limit, etc. Ick.
If the Google Play Store's policies become too aggressive, app developers will begin to shift to competing stores or distribute directly or find HTML5 workarounds. Of course I agree that Google should have reasonable policies, but if you don't like them, they (unlike Apple) at least give you alternatives.