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Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

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Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, I see where we misunderstood each other. You're talking about conclusions she reached that are debatable - and, indeed, debated rather a lot. I also disagree with some of them, but don't feel that qualifies her as a liar, just someone with whom I don't agree on everything. Possibly even someone that sometimes uses hyperbole to make her points. I'm most likely guilty of the same sin myself and don't begrudge he…

In my mind, intellectual dishonesty equates to lying; especially considering how she absolutely refuses to accept any kind of criticism or address the very real and concrete problems with her conclusions. Some of these things aren't "debatable", she's completely ignorant (either willfully or not is another question, and i'm leaning towards 'willful' due to either the total lack of response or personal attacks that an…

In case the "lack of response" was directed at me, for the very specific Hitman thing: yes, the game penalises you for killing the dancers (hookers?). I'm pretty sure the penalty is lifted if you hide the bodies, though. So, yes, you're penalised, unless you are not. One might almost think you willfully witheld that particular piece of information.

As for the "well gamergate is worse" thing.

It was not what I meant, although I see how it could come off that way. My point was: the people who accuse her of lying have been repeatedly shown to be lying themselves. On the whole, I'd rather trust the person who has not (yet?) been proven to be a liar than the ones who have.

Lastly, it's usually the case that when accusing someone of something, said accusation looses all credibility if its author is guilty of the same thing - regardless of the initial accusation's merit. If you want your argument that she lies to be listened to, then you need to stick to the truth, hard as it can be. If you want to accuse her of witholding information, make absolutely sure you're not doing the same thing.

And, and this should go without saying, if you want to have any credibility, do not willingly associate yourself with people who threaten to rape and kill someone over games (I realise that you haven't explicitly stated you were part of gamergate - you're using the rethoric, but I apologise is my assumption is incorrect).

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#332
post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2014/06/concealed_w... http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/03/us-usa-guncontrol-... I'd say the lack of basic gun safety skill among concealed weapons holders is sufficient evidence to be concerned. This is just in the last 3-4 months with a quick google search. If I can't trust people with guns to reliably follow basic safety procedures [e.g. Both of these sound like someo…

Out of 8 million licensees, plus anyone who wants to with a clean record in Vermont, Alaska, Whyoming, and Arizona, there's going to be people who screw up. Police do at a much higher rate , in my observation over the years (there are, after all, a lot less of them). Years, as in the wave of "shall issue" concealed carry regimes started with Florida in 1987, and now includes 43 states and most of the population. Ever…

> Out of 8 million licensees, plus anyone who wants to with a clean record in Vermont, Alaska, Whyoming, and Arizona, there's going to be people who screw up. Police do at a much higher rate, in my observation over the years (there are, after all, a lot less of them).

Police also frequently have long shifts where they are exhausted and are carrying a firearm. Its not surprising they'd screw up more frequently than a population with relatively ideal operating conditions.

> Years, as in the wave of "shall issue" concealed carry regimes started with Florida in 1987, and now includes 43 states and most of the population. Every time a state goes shall issue the usual suspects scream "blood in the streets", yet it never comes to pass, as they mean it. Here you're stretching quite a bit to go form "normal" accidents to postulated future bad actions in a shooting event, because you can't find any of the latter. (You can't because there aren't any, at least that I've learned about since the early '70s and my readings of prior modern history.)

I didn't scream blood in the streets. I pointed out that questioning the competence of people who carry weapons as they've been shown to be injure themselves through carelessness...is very reasonable.

You are attacking other people and somehow relating that to what I said.

You've pointed out there was 1 event at which someone with a CCW permit and a weapon existed in recent history. Attempting to draw conclusions from such a small number of events is idiocy. But you go ahead.

> There are going to have to be a lot more, and much more worse screwups, before the toll is a fraction of the massacres in NewSpeak "Gun Free" zones.

http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/29/us/children-and-guns-the-h...

1) They are undercounted because they are sometimes labeled homicides.

2) Lets use the CDC #s: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr63/nvsr63_03.pdf Firearm (*U01.4,W32-W34,X72-X74,X93-X95,Y22-Y24,Y35.0) 32,351 10.4 10.2 Unintentional (W32-W34) 591 0.2 0.2

591 "Unintentional" deaths in 2011.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/03/26/1077930/-Statistics...

2008-2009 was over 1000.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/02/21/mass-sh...

This puts the number at 934 over 7 years.

So you are just ignorant is the underlying problem. 2 years of unintentional fatalities is more than 6 years of mass shootings.

I'd say that is a problem more dangerous than the delusion that the guy with the CCW is going to alter the outcome significantly.

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#333
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

http://www.cleveland.com/metro/index.ssf/2014/06/concealed_w... http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/09/03/us-usa-guncontrol-... I'd say the lack of basic gun safety skill among concealed weapons holders is sufficient evidence to be concerned. This is just in the last 3-4 months with a quick google search. If I can't trust people with guns to reliably follow basic safety procedures [e.g. Both of these sound like someo…

Many very popular types of guns do not have "safeties" in the sense that you are likely thinking. They do not have a switch that can be toggled between "safe" and "fire". Glocks are one prominent example (they lack some sort of safety switch, although they have other sorts of safety features.) Truly mechanically induced accidents are nevertheless exceptionally rare. The guns only fire when the trigger is pulled, whic…

That is why you wouldn't carry such a weapon as a CCW and hope for the best. You'd pick one with a safety if your goal was safety.

"Exceptionally rare" events that send you to the hospital should be minimized if you are acting rationally. Choosing an "unpopular" gun with a safety vs. a "popular" gun with a safety...well, that isn't giving up the gun now is it?

That is why I have an issue with gun enthusiasts. They don't think and they literally get people killed/injured because of it. Then go "well its rare..."

So fucking what. Cars have a ton of safety features to reduce fatalities too even tho such fatalities are "rare".

If gun owners continue to show poor judgement when they have time to think about it rationally, why should I think they'll do any better under pressure?

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#334

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my mind, intellectual dishonesty equates to lying; especially considering how she absolutely refuses to accept any kind of criticism or address the very real and concrete problems with her conclusions. Some of these things aren't "debatable", she's completely ignorant (either willfully or not is another question, and i'm leaning towards 'willful' due to either the total lack of response or personal attacks that an…

In case the "lack of response" was directed at me, for the very specific Hitman thing: yes, the game penalises you for killing the dancers (hookers?). I'm pretty sure the penalty is lifted if you hide the bodies, though. So, yes, you're penalised, unless you are not. One might almost think you willfully witheld that particular piece of information. As for the "well gamergate is worse" thing. It was not what I meant,…

Nono, the "lack of response" was directed at Sarkeesian - there is not one instance in which she or her supporters respond to criticisms of her arguments with anything other than silence or personal attacks.

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#335
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I legitimately cannot decide what scares me more, the thought of a mass shooting, or the thought of a bunch of "heroes" with a concealed carry cross-firing. Mark my words, one day a mass shooting will occur, someone will pull out their concealed carry, and a second concealed carry person will come around the corner and shoot the first (or the police will). Once there is panic and an unknown threat, adding more guns i…

You know, there's more than a bit of history with this, and it's never come to pass. For example, of all the recent mass shooting events, only one didn't happen in an ironically official "No Gun Zone", the Arizona congresswoman shooting. Turns out a concealed carrier showed up just as the shooter was getting wrestled to the ground. Surprise, surprise, he didn't shoot. So you're just libeling people like me. Who you c…

That makes little sense. Your counterpoint is that when a private citizen came around the corner carrying a gun, whilst civilians, cops and security were tackling the shooter to the ground, he didn't shoot, that means that it's impossible that two people carrying could confuse one another for the actual shooter at an MCI?

No, your example shows little in that regard.

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

12 seconds after it was posted? I don't fall for that "explanation".

At this point, she likely has a pretty good routine for screenshotting death threats. Click the notification (OSX notifies me on an OS level immediately, and I personally typically click immediately if I'm at my computer), see it's nasty, Command+Shift+4. 12 seconds is entirely doable and feasible.

And what's the point of logging out or going into the porn mode?

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, she likely has a pretty good routine for screenshotting death threats. Click the notification (OSX notifies me on an OS level immediately, and I personally typically click immediately if I'm at my computer), see it's nasty, Command+Shift+4. 12 seconds is entirely doable and feasible.

And what's the point of logging out or going into the porn mode?

I use Tweetbot as my client. When an OSX Twitter notification comes in and I click it, it takes me to Chrome, where I'm not logged in because I never use their web interface.

I wonder what your next goalpost move will be.

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#338
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It better be. She raised $158K on Kickstarter to make these YouTube videos. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/566429325/tropes-vs-wom...

I keep seeing her getting criticized for this and I don't get it. She didn't ask for that much, it just happened.

I don't think it's so much criticized for this, as people appealing to authority - witness upstream, where someone says 'you have to admit, there's a lot of leg work done, the videos look impressive' - which says nothing about the content or message - to which someone says "well, yes, but this isn't about 'how professional a video series can you produce given $160,000+?'.

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#339
post #267
post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep; it was not the massacre threat but the refusal to deny concealed carry that prompted Anita to cancel her event. The title implies a wrong causality like that. I can't imagine attending an event where people could carry concealed weapon, even as completely average dude.

In what country do you live? In the US, I assume that 10-15% of adults are carrying a handgun wherever I go, and I feel perfectly safe with it. In some states, like New Hampshire, I think it's probably more like 1/3.

This is much more of a state thing than a country thing. I've never seen a gun in real life (except holstered on a cop), living in New Jersey and New York.

Re: Feminist video-games talk pulled after massacre threat

#340
post #324

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't even need to be a false flag. All it takes is one un-hinged idiot who thinks they're Doing The Right Thing, and by the standards that HN users apparently have, that's enough to discard the entire movement. Because, yknow, a group's most unhinged members only stand for the movement when it's GG, even when those members are denounced by everyone else, but that same standard doesn't apply to people on the oth…

By that logic, you can't judge any group in any way for doing anything because anything anyone does can be reduced to being an "un-hinged idiot".

Not at all. I can show you on pretty much every organizing point for GamerGate where there are rules in place about sexist or nasty comments, where people have been massively reported for trying to organize an invasion (on a chan board no less!) and so on.

Those leading the outrage train against gamergate are doing a fantastic job of cherry picking while ignoring this larger trend.

And by the way, lest you think that the concerns about "false flags" are just paranoid rantings, it is a thing that has happened before.

[1] http://gamergate.giz.moe/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/faking-h...

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