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The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

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61–70 of 136 posts

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#61
post #12

Is it such a good idea to invest in something that's built on deprecated software (Windows XP)? And to handle money, no less. I'm a layman in regards to this, but is there a valid reason to choose XP over, lets say, a LTS Ubuntu release? Maybe some PCI ruling or something like that? Just seems strange and I've had a bad vibe ever since I read it.

Man, the little transit card beeper thingies at the new train stations in Minneapolis use Windows. It's everywhere.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#62
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting, thanks for the clarification.

This is true, you'll notice atm machines when under maintenance shows the classic XP screen. Though I do not know, why they still use that.

Because ATMs are usually not connected to the Internet, so there are minimal attack vectors. Every time you make a transaction the ATM literally rings up the bank, using an old fashioned modem. They could probably have Windows 95 installed on them and they would still work fine.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#63
I have had some dealings with fraudulent merchants (while running a popular price comparison site and dealing with customer complaints, criminal charges against mervchants etc.) in the past 14 years and my gut feeling with this is that this Jordan has already spent your money on his expensive lifestyle.

It's the repeated false promises and claims he makes in his e-mails that create this impression, for example the quick refund. A serious businessman only promises this if he can make absolutely sure that the customer will get it (and it doesn't matter that he wrote "we hope to ...", it's a clear message). I've also read Jordan's reddit posts, sounds fishy as hell.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#64
post #36

If you're wondering how you should do these types of transactions without putting cash up front, the field is called trade finance. Call your bank - most of them have a trade finance desk, or Google the term. A slightly cheaper way of doing it is to have a lawyer draft a terms of trade or supply agreement with either the funds in escrow with the firm or a bank guarantee. Having your bank finance the trade is worthwhi…

>There is a huge opportunity in cutting the costs and fees associated with trade finance with bitcoin.

Why is there an opportunity with bitcoin? Aren't the costs and fees paying for the legal agreements, risk management, arbitration and things like that? Bitcoin might possibly reduce the cost of moving the dollars around but I suspect this is a very small fraction of the cost of this type of service.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#65
post #64
post #36

If you're wondering how you should do these types of transactions without putting cash up front, the field is called trade finance. Call your bank - most of them have a trade finance desk, or Google the term. A slightly cheaper way of doing it is to have a lawyer draft a terms of trade or supply agreement with either the funds in escrow with the firm or a bank guarantee. Having your bank finance the trade is worthwhi…

>There is a huge opportunity in cutting the costs and fees associated with trade finance with bitcoin. Why is there an opportunity with bitcoin? Aren't the costs and fees paying for the legal agreements, risk management, arbitration and things like that? Bitcoin might possibly reduce the cost of moving the dollars around but I suspect this is a very small fraction of the cost of this type of service.

Not to mention the fx risk involved.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#66
post #36

If you're wondering how you should do these types of transactions without putting cash up front, the field is called trade finance. Call your bank - most of them have a trade finance desk, or Google the term. A slightly cheaper way of doing it is to have a lawyer draft a terms of trade or supply agreement with either the funds in escrow with the firm or a bank guarantee. Having your bank finance the trade is worthwhi…

Like a bank is going to offer trade finance on this?!? Seriously. That should be clue enough.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#68
post #36

If you're wondering how you should do these types of transactions without putting cash up front, the field is called trade finance. Call your bank - most of them have a trade finance desk, or Google the term. A slightly cheaper way of doing it is to have a lawyer draft a terms of trade or supply agreement with either the funds in escrow with the firm or a bank guarantee. Having your bank finance the trade is worthwhi…

[deleted]

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#69
post #27

The fraud level in the Bitcoin world is so high that it makes South Florida look good. There's a working Robocoin ATM at Hacker Dojo in Mountain View, CA. Nobody uses it. Nor should they. 15% bid/ask spread, 5% fee. Incidentally, the retail price for an ordinary ATM machine is $2,000 to $4,500, depending on the features ordered. A standard through-the-wall bank ATM is about $9,500. Even if you order every option from…

"Incidentally, the retail price for an ordinary ATM machine is $2,000 to $4,500" But, but.... those banks know nothing about bitcoin, it's the future... And of course, the markup is moot, because you didn't get the product.

That's the dumbest argument ever. You are comparing one of the most expensive bitcoin ATMs with the cheapest traditional ATMs. "But, but" is the core of your argument.

Re: The Great Robocoin Rip-off: How We Lost $25,000 Buying a Robocoin ATM

#70
post #36

If you're wondering how you should do these types of transactions without putting cash up front, the field is called trade finance. Call your bank - most of them have a trade finance desk, or Google the term. A slightly cheaper way of doing it is to have a lawyer draft a terms of trade or supply agreement with either the funds in escrow with the firm or a bank guarantee. Having your bank finance the trade is worthwhi…

Like a bank is going to offer trade finance on this?!? Seriously. That should be clue enough.

Why not? They get a commission. Banks issue close similar deals (letters of credit) all the time for single-container shipments in international trade. A 20K transaction is certainly not below their notice, they have entire departments specialized in services for small business. The less trade volume you have with them, the higher their commission (in %)!
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