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When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

nytimes.com

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Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#11

Post by owenmarshall »

bsbechtel wrote: post #6

The article has a pretty obvious slant in one direction. A lot of times small businesses will require this of their entry level workers not because they are afraid of their workers going to a competitor, but don't want their employees to go and start a competing business, which in the small business world is a very real risk. It costs much less to start a small business, and in the local market many of these small bu…

> I'm not necessarily saying this is wrong or right, but it's the other side of the story the NYT didn't discuss.

Probably because it's a really dumb side to the story?

An individual Jimmy Johns franchise has to worry about one of their sandwich assemblers starting their own deli as much as I have to worry about catching ebola.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#12

Post by pyrocat »

bsbechtel wrote: post #6

The article has a pretty obvious slant in one direction. A lot of times small businesses will require this of their entry level workers not because they are afraid of their workers going to a competitor, but don't want their employees to go and start a competing business, which in the small business world is a very real risk. It costs much less to start a small business, and in the local market many of these small bu…

"It costs much less to start a small business"

Ok, I'll bite. In what way does starting a small business "cost less"? Less than what? Have you ever tried to get a loan to start a retail restaurant? It's incredibly difficult to get the funding necessary, especially in an industry with such low margins.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#13

Post by joezydeco »

bsbechtel wrote: post #6

The article has a pretty obvious slant in one direction. A lot of times small businesses will require this of their entry level workers not because they are afraid of their workers going to a competitor, but don't want their employees to go and start a competing business, which in the small business world is a very real risk. It costs much less to start a small business, and in the local market many of these small bu…

Let's not fool ourselves. A minimum-wage worker has hardly the resources, knowledge, and time to start a business. Are the non-competes coming from the corporate arm (who potentially has a secret formula to lose, but again lets not kid ourselves), or is the non-compete coming from the local franchise owner?

The more likely reason is because JJ's and/or the franchisee know that their line workers can and frequently do hop jobs over small things like consistency of hours, a manager they don't get along with, or a $0.25 increase in pay. Lost manpower and retraining hurts the store's bottom line.

I was just in a Chipotle last night, standing behind a Starbucks worker taking a break from the shop next door. The SBux worker and the Chipotle line staff instantly started an exchange over who they knew was hiring, what the conditions were like at their respective stores, and what the pay was. Everyone keeps their ear to the ground these days.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#14

Post by sequoia »

bsbechtel wrote: post #6

The article has a pretty obvious slant in one direction. A lot of times small businesses will require this of their entry level workers not because they are afraid of their workers going to a competitor, but don't want their employees to go and start a competing business, which in the small business world is a very real risk. It costs much less to start a small business, and in the local market many of these small bu…

Absolutely. I'm sure the noncompete is the only thing saving JJ's from having their secret sandwich formula stolen by the kid they pay $8/hr. If not for that NCA she'd probably cross the street and open her own "2,000-location sandwich chain" & put JJ's out of business. Thank goodness for this wholly appropriate, not at all exploitative use of NC agreements and darn that socialist newspaper!!

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#16

Post by VLM »

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #5

This got a little too typically NYT generic and preachy at the end -- I was expecting either an altar call or somebody to pass a collection plate -- but the specific case about non-competes deserves some attention. For all the things California is doing to drive out businesses, one great thing about the state is that non-competes have very little weight. (In fact, this was what led Google and Apple to screw over the…

"The measures are very rarely enforced"

Don't get into an agreement you're not willing to enforce... lets be realistic, the victims are judgment proof, if they lose, the company might be able to repo their hat or apron, that's about it.

Most likely result is if you quit and tell your boss you're going to a competitor of any sort in the food service industry, you won't get your last pay check. It'll cost too much to get it, so corporate wide its free money for the company across the large set of all employees.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#17

Post by aroch »

krigi wrote: post #3

I've been under non-competes before. I've just ignored them. Most of them are unenforceable and in cases like Jimmy John's are just another form of harassment.

Hell, many places will release you from a non-complete if it gets you to fuck off faster after being let go. Non-competes aren't really about punishing after you leave, they are there to "encourage" you to stay.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#18

Post by bsbechtel »

pyrocat wrote: post #12
bsbechtel wrote: post #6

The article has a pretty obvious slant in one direction. A lot of times small businesses will require this of their entry level workers not because they are afraid of their workers going to a competitor, but don't want their employees to go and start a competing business, which in the small business world is a very real risk. It costs much less to start a small business, and in the local market many of these small bu…

"It costs much less to start a small business" Ok, I'll bite. In what way does starting a small business "cost less"? Less than what? Have you ever tried to get a loan to start a retail restaurant? It's incredibly difficult to get the funding necessary, especially in an industry with such low margins.

Retail fast food restaurant - All these businesses can be started with either 1) personal savings, 2) a family and friends loan, or 3) credit cards. They all also have the advantage of generating cash from day 1, vs a tech startup which can have substantial development time.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#19

Post by nissimk »

Non compete clauses do not make sense for employees that are not highly compensated. They are a violation of the 13th amendment and frequently unenforceable. This doesn't stop people from trying to use them as a tool to increase employee retention especially in the face of poor work conditions and bad management. If an employer insists on one, you should ask for compensation. Make sure they agree to pay you some amount greater than your equivalent total compensation with benefits for the entire duration of the non-compete period.

Re: When the Guy Making Your Sandwich Has a Noncompete Clause

#20

Post by [deleted] »

bsbechtel wrote: post #6

The article has a pretty obvious slant in one direction. A lot of times small businesses will require this of their entry level workers not because they are afraid of their workers going to a competitor, but don't want their employees to go and start a competing business, which in the small business world is a very real risk. It costs much less to start a small business, and in the local market many of these small bu…

[deleted]
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