and they they share sources -> http://popcorn-time.se/source.html
DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
81–90 of 111 posts
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#82Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tools designed to circumvent copyright are illegal too.
You mean circumvent access controls to copyrighted material. I'm not sure this circumvents access controls, does it?
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#83Earlier quoted context omitted.
The real spirit of IP law is "art, music, and creative professions should be viable professions for which people can actually get paid." Whether it accomplishes that is debatable at times, and it's certainly misused, but that's why it exists. "Information wants to be free" is a terrible argument from the naturalistic fallacy. Cars want to break down, your body wants to get cancer, and ebola wants to spread. The quest…
That sounds like a reasonable proposal for what the real spirit of IP law should be, but certainly not what it actually is.
I think my general point is this:
In a world where energy, food, and real estate are inflating and wages are flat or deflating, it behooves us to be incredibly skeptical of any agenda or meme that devalues or takes leverage away from labor. Ask yourself "cui bono?"
"Information wants to be free" is another way of saying "I don't want to pay people for knowledge work or art." Now who wouldn't want to do that? Maybe... oh... I don't know... multi-billion-dollar companies that make money by shoveling "content" out to consumers in exchange for being able to track their every move and sell it to advertisers? If they have to pay for content, that's just a cost to them. So it behooves those industries to promote the meme that piracy is great and information should be free, since it helps to devalue the "content" that they need to keep their surveillance based marketing machines running.
I'm starting to see the purveyors of aggressive industrial-scale piracy as being analogous to the brown shirt types that used to go out and bust kneecaps of union members to intimidate them into accepting concessions. Dropping the bottom out of higher-priced content models makes producers of content more willing to accept pennies on the dollar later.
I've been skeptical of free for a while, but believe it or not the Snowden revelations really pushed me over the edge. It made it very clear that free == surveillance is the business model, and it therefore got me really thinking skeptically about the concept of free (as in beer).
I don't think it's always bad. I work on open source software. But I think it must be the creator's choice.
I'm also not a fan of the DMCA as written -- it contains some nasty and odious terms that are ripe for abuse like the "anti-circumvention" clause -- but in this case I think it's being used in the right way to shut down something that's deliberately abusive.
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#84Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tools designed to circumvent copyright are illegal too.
Ah. Good point. This is under the DMCA act? I guess the problem then becomes defining what exactly constitutes a tool that aids in infringement. A debugger is potentially a tool that can be used to circumvent copyright (let's say, by means of bypassing a very weak protection scheme). But it's obviously not only for this case, so you might argue that if the tool's sole purpose is to circumvent copyright it would have…
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/1201
>A debugger is potentially a tool that can be used to circumvent copyright
IANAL, but it seems that what matters is that the tool is primarily designed for circumventing copyright, has practically no other use than to circumvent copyright, or is marketed by the manufacturer as a tool to circumvent copyright.
You can pirate things with a browser, you can crack software with a debugger or hex editor. But these aren't the primary and only purposes of these tools.
>[...] but it's only one config file away from streaming illegal content from torrents.
If it has legitimate legal uses, and the config file that allows illegal streaming isn't provided by default, nor advertised by the manufacturer, or a group that the manufacturer gives approval to, then hopefully everything will be ok.
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#85> Attached as Exhibit A is a series of screenshots taken from within the applications of each Project that includes images of copyrighted works available through the Projects. The representative titles shown in Exhibit A consist of only some of the motion pictures and television programs that are owned or controlled by the MPAA Member Studios and that are being infringed via the Projects. Exhibit A is provided as a r…
The Big Difference between Popcorn Time and Chrome or Bit torrent is that while Chrome and Bit torrent are can be made to do illegal things such as pirate movies, Popcorn Time is explicitly made with the intention of illegally pirating movies. The screenshots provided basically show that Popcorn Time is not just an app for legally playing content. It would be very difficult to argue to a judge "This app was not desig…
DMCA 1201 has nothing to do with Popcorn Time. That covers DRM circumvention (and should be repealed). The theory of liability for Popcorn Time is under the Grokster ruling, if the authors are inducing copyright infringement by promoting the tool for that purpose.
The notice and takedown provision is DMCA 512, which is a safe harbor for hosts like Github. It says (roughly) that you aren't liable for copyright infringement of your users if you timely respond to take down notices. But Github wouldn't be liable for copyright infringement anyway because the Popcorn Time software is not copyrighted by the claimants and Github isn't the party allegedly inducing copyright infringement. So Github apparently doesn't have to comply with the notice if they don't want to.
Of course, almost everyone complies with all notices whatsoever regardless of how absurd or invalid they are, because the host doesn't have a strong enough incentive to fight somebody else's battle. That's the free speech issue.
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#86> Attached as Exhibit A is a series of screenshots taken from within the applications of each Project that includes images of copyrighted works available through the Projects. The representative titles shown in Exhibit A consist of only some of the motion pictures and television programs that are owned or controlled by the MPAA Member Studios and that are being infringed via the Projects. Exhibit A is provided as a r…
The Big Difference between Popcorn Time and Chrome or Bit torrent is that while Chrome and Bit torrent are can be made to do illegal things such as pirate movies, Popcorn Time is explicitly made with the intention of illegally pirating movies. The screenshots provided basically show that Popcorn Time is not just an app for legally playing content. It would be very difficult to argue to a judge "This app was not desig…
Intention is a quality of the author, not a quality of the work. In the real world governed by the laws of reality, an object or tool or even bundle of software has no intention. It's just a thing.
Claiming that the intention can magically transfer through the object is like some 21st century form of shamanism.
I reject such stupid notions.
If, generally speaking, this software is used to commit illegal acts, then it is those acts which are illegal, not the tool that is used in the commission of the acts.
By banning the tools, you're not preventing the illegal act... you're preventing anyone from using it for legal acts, and cementing the idea that it is only used for those things illegal.
But we're not even really talking about banning it... that would cost too much in lobbyist bribes, too much political capital, too much time and effort. Instead, we're going to twist existing laws to pretend that somehow someone else's code can be censored because of some unfounded ideas about what the code does. That's a chickenshit move if ever there was one.
> If you think not being able to share copyrighted content without the permission of the copyright holder violates the first ammendment then you should be working towards repealing
I no longer trust that our government represents its people well enough for that to be possible. And I reject the idea that you can just set me off on impossible quests and that if I refuse them you win the argument.
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#87It's sad that there isn't a studio exec out there who can make the leap to realize that there is a impedance mismatch in the market that they can capitalize on. Netflix resoundingly proved that there is an appetite for streaming movies and TV, and the studios' response has been to...withhold content, and when they do license it, to do so at enormously exorbitant rates. Do they actually think that if they just make it…
At some level both these apps are big time enablers of copyright infringement. Maybe you don't think that's a bad thing and all copyright laws should be gutted, or maybe you want to play lawyer or (worse) make analogies. That is totally not the point here.
The point is, what some view as copyright infringement, others view as unsatisfied demand. Music has already crossed the chasm, but that's probably more because there is so much more of it in such smaller economic units. Big budget movies have more mass and will find it harder to leap that chasm to streaming services.
I think that if anyone manages it, it will be Apple. And it will start with TV, not movies.
I will take issue with cheald's "marginal manufacturing cost" argument, a big budget movie has to make back its gigantic capital investment, and each unit of consumption has to pay its share.
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#88Earlier quoted context omitted.
"it is crazy to ban knives because you can stab people with them." That's true when looking at kitchen knifes, but to stretch your analogy: popcorn time is to other media applications as GI Joe's Combat knife is to other knives. It's not made to butter your bread: it's made to stab people. Popcorn time was made specifically to infringe, that's not to say that the copyright system is not hopelessly broken, but imo thi…
Yes, it's a similar to gun control arguments. Some guns are more for self-defense, or hunting animals, other guns, like assault rifles, are designed for war. The reason I said a DCMA takedown doesn't make sense is because they are usually to take down actual media, like a youtube video, not the source code to a tool. But I think they didn't really have options and wanted it done quickly.
So we live in a world where laws don't matter, only expediency in pursuit of the goals of the copyright cartels?
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#89Earlier quoted context omitted.
> With those applications you can get from clean install to playing a copyrighted movie in three clicks. You don't do that with a web browser. Sure you can. Click 1: https://www.reddit.com/r/fullmoviesonyoutube/ Click 2: Select a movie. Copyright infringement in two easy clicks!
Where did that URL come from? That's what I meant by "clean install". You can really get from zero to copyright violation in three clicks and no external knowledge by using those applications.
Re: DMCA Takedown Notice for Popcorn Time and Time4Popcorn
#90Earlier quoted context omitted.
That sounds like a reasonable proposal for what the real spirit of IP law should be, but certainly not what it actually is.
It's broken, but getting rid of it entirely doesn't fix the problem. It makes it worse. I think my general point is this: In a world where energy, food, and real estate are inflating and wages are flat or deflating, it behooves us to be incredibly skeptical of any agenda or meme that devalues or takes leverage away from labor. Ask yourself "cui bono?" "Information wants to be free" is another way of saying "I don't w…
I never suggested that getting rid of it entirely would fix the problem.
> "Information wants to be free" is another way of saying "I don't want to pay people for knowledge work or art."
I'm not a fan of the mantra "information wants to be free," but I also don't think that opposing strict IP laws is equivalent to not wanting people to pay for knowledge or art. It might be equivalent to opposing the viability of certain business plans for monetizing IP, but there are other business plans for monetizing IP that don't rely on being subsidized by draconian and borderline orwellian IP enforcement.
I don't really see the connection you're trying to make between pro-piracy groups and massive advertising corporations.