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The Limits of Friendship

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21–30 of 59 posts

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#21
post #17

Seems like either Dunbar's number is from some alternate reality or many of the commenters (including myself) are the alternate reality...

I assume that the numbers quoted are more about the brains capacity at each level of engagement.

I assume it would adjust for introvert/ extrovert. Like others here I would find maintaining the number of relationships at those number very tiring.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#22
Have you ever lived somewhere, perhaps a city, where all your close friends change every few years because everyone keeps moving? That was my case living in Vancouver. I have since moved and have had to start over myself. I find that it takes a while to build close friends especially once you are in the job market and everyone has families. It also takes a lot of effort to keep close friends because i'm so busy with non-social things and sporting activities that I'm rarely free just to hang as I did in University. This is doubly true for those in relationships as we also have to spend time with our partners friends and families too.

Not complaining, but it's difficult to adjust to compared to grad school.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#23
post #20

Reading the comments, I'd say many members of HN should probably invest more time fostering friendships. Its not that difficult to maintain relationships but it is shockingly easy to let them dissipate. Every so often I set out to "make the rounds" and see my friends who are spread across the country. I'm a bit of a nomad and yet its often my return that triggers close friends to see each other when they live minutes…

I wish I would have. Sad thing is, the ease of developing new friendships seems to be a function of the number of existing ones. Once you reach zero, like I have, you're pretty much stuck there.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#24
There are also many positive ways to manage an extended network of friends - ie. the people you don't see on a day-to-day basis.

For example, I definitely don't abuse my social network and groom it on a regular basis, both public and private feeds and profiles. My LinkedIn account has "only" 83 connections and my Facebook has 143. Yes, I know every single one of them. Facebook in particular has allowed me to connect with my extended family overseas so I put a lot of value into each of my posts on there, even if others choose not to. Sometimes I even translate my own posts for the sake of my non-English speaking family so as to guarantee the furthest reach of my social broadcasts.

Everyone is always happy when I reach out to them, even if it's only once a year on Facebook. I also try not to do it on the day of their birthday, on holidays, or on any special day per say as it amplifies the gesture.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#25
"On the flipside, groups can extend to five hundred, the acquaintance level, and to fifteen hundred, the absolute limit—the people for whom you can put a name to a face."

This is spot on. I was able to reliably recall passengers I'd had driving for lyft up to about 1000 rides, which is 1500 minus the "number of facebook friends I have".

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#26
post #23
post #20

Reading the comments, I'd say many members of HN should probably invest more time fostering friendships. Its not that difficult to maintain relationships but it is shockingly easy to let them dissipate. Every so often I set out to "make the rounds" and see my friends who are spread across the country. I'm a bit of a nomad and yet its often my return that triggers close friends to see each other when they live minutes…

I wish I would have. Sad thing is, the ease of developing new friendships seems to be a function of the number of existing ones. Once you reach zero, like I have, you're pretty much stuck there.

New relationships are a combination of luck and hard work, regardless of your current state. I think having additional friendships just increases the luck side of the equation slightly.

If you want to develop new friendships I'd say find hobbies where you might find interesting people. Some hobbies tend to have more welcoming communities than others, climbing gyms being one of the better environments I've come across for meeting new people.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#27
post #3

In high school I had 30 casual friends and 15 close friends, at University I had 20 casual friends and 10 close friends, now I have 10 casual friends and 5 close friends, I predict them to reduce to zero when I get married. :(

Well, interestingly enough, it seems like you lose 2 close friends for every new romantic relationship:

http://www.theguardian.com/science/2010/sep/15/price-love-cl...

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#28
post #23
post #20

Reading the comments, I'd say many members of HN should probably invest more time fostering friendships. Its not that difficult to maintain relationships but it is shockingly easy to let them dissipate. Every so often I set out to "make the rounds" and see my friends who are spread across the country. I'm a bit of a nomad and yet its often my return that triggers close friends to see each other when they live minutes…

I wish I would have. Sad thing is, the ease of developing new friendships seems to be a function of the number of existing ones. Once you reach zero, like I have, you're pretty much stuck there.

Stuck's pessimistic, but my experiences lead me to agree. I find it difficult to take the initiative with new people, so many of the people I know I met through a mutual friend.

I don't have a perfect solution, but I've found a few tricks. I've found that clubs and volunteer events tend to be full of friendly people who will introduce themselves. It also helps me socialize with new people when no one else knows each other.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#29
What I'd love to know is how people carve out time and energy for learning/self-driven education, hobbies and such in addition to friends, particularly if introverted.

My wife seems to be quite good at making friends, because she invests a large % of her time and energy in socializing, and I feel like it is slightly less awkward for a female to invite female coworkers out to do something than it is for male coworkers (feel free to rebut me here). Fortunately, many of her friends have SO's that I've become friendly with, and we have a variety of "couple friends" we do group activities with where she also frequently hangs out with the female half of that equation 1:1.

I on the other hand have multiple hobbies, am working on teaching myself to code, and am constantly teaching myself new things (for example, I was brushing up on multivariable regression analysis at 1am in bed). I barely have time for this as it is without adding socialization to the mix, but I feel like I get more fulfillment out of my current approach. I've certainly learned more as a result.

I'm also an introvert. I can be very social and likable in the moment, but making new friends and the simple act of socializing is draining vs. my other solo activities which replenish my reserves.

Seriously, I'd love to know how people strike that balance and how they make new friends/maintain existing ones without constantly running on empty from the time and energy it takes to do so.

Re: The Limits of Friendship

#30
post #26
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish I would have. Sad thing is, the ease of developing new friendships seems to be a function of the number of existing ones. Once you reach zero, like I have, you're pretty much stuck there.

New relationships are a combination of luck and hard work, regardless of your current state. I think having additional friendships just increases the luck side of the equation slightly. If you want to develop new friendships I'd say find hobbies where you might find interesting people. Some hobbies tend to have more welcoming communities than others, climbing gyms being one of the better environments I've come across…

Totally agree. And some sports are just friendlier than others.

I play badminton, and I've occasionally played ultimate frisbee, and both have a great inclusiveness culture, at least in Colorado, Washington, Texas, and California, the places I've variously played. Much of my current group of friends that I haven't met through geek-oriented meetups I met playing badminton.

I also used to play volleyball, but ... well, too many jerks turned me off. Now I only play with friends at parties.

It's worth emphasizing that making new friends takes time. It was a year before I felt I had good local friends after moving to Colorado, and 2-4 years before I was doing things with them outside of our original meeting group. It probably could be done faster -- I suck at the whole social thing -- but for the poster above who claimed to be stuck at zero: Put in the time, do the work, take a chance by reaching out, and you can build friendships.

ALSO: Watch this TED talk:

http://www.ted.com/talks/brene_brown_on_vulnerability

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