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'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

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Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#61

Post by mcherm »

anonbanker wrote: post #55

Most people have watched enough "Cops" to have memorized the script. Now, go grab a copy of a law dictionary (I use Bouvier's or Black's) and read the definition of every word in that script. You'll be amazed at what it really means. Silence is considered acceptance in contempt. A cop telling you that you have the right to put yourself in contempt, when you have a duty as a taxpaying citizen to respond, should give y…

I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say.

It sounds like you are implying that keeping mum is legally equivalent to agreeing to anything that a police officer says. That simply isn't true.

If you have something useful to contribute, please make it more clear and include a citation somewhat more precise than "somewhere within the 2052 pages of Black's Law Dictionary".

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#62

Post by nsxwolf »

phkahler wrote: post #23

"Sir, can you tell me how fast you were going?" I've always wondered what the best answer would be.

I've always said "... I thought I was going the limit... was I?" and I get off with a warning most of the time. I always answer any follow up some utterance like "oh...", but I never explicitly admit fault.

I get off with a warning for most offenses but I think it's more about being very polite and cooperative.

Source: I get stopped once or twice a year for various reasons. (Have been driving for 20 years, 20-40 stops)

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#63

Post by anonbanker »

mcherm wrote: post #61
anonbanker wrote: post #55

Most people have watched enough "Cops" to have memorized the script. Now, go grab a copy of a law dictionary (I use Bouvier's or Black's) and read the definition of every word in that script. You'll be amazed at what it really means. Silence is considered acceptance in contempt. A cop telling you that you have the right to put yourself in contempt, when you have a duty as a taxpaying citizen to respond, should give y…

I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say. It sounds like you are implying that keeping mum is legally equivalent to agreeing to anything that a police officer says. That simply isn't true. If you have something useful to contribute, please make it more clear and include a citation somewhat more precise than "somewhere within the 2052 pages of Black's Law Dictionary".

Interesting quote you put there. Did I say that?

But sure, i'll be happy to do your homework for you. Grab your book, an look up the following words: "You" "Right" "Remain" "Silent" "Attorney" "Afford" "Understand"

Those would probably be a good start for you. You'll learn they don't mean what you think they mean.

Afterwards, might I suggest a book on offer and acceptance? The "Examples and Explanations" series has a great book on Contracts, and might get you to a deeper understanding of the meaning of silence.

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#64

Post by morganvachon »

freehunter wrote: post #42
morganvachon wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not that I think the US is there yet, but the answer is that having so many laws that basically waking up and going about your daily routine means breaking at least a few laws, is the ultimate goal. If everything is a crime and everyone is a criminal, it's much easier for the government to control the people rather than the other way around. This concept comes up in many science fiction works, even non-Dystopian ones…

I've always wondered this while driving through Chicago. The speed limit is 55mph, but everyone, cops included, goes 70 when traffic allows for it. And I've done 80mph with a cop behind me and not been pulled over. Which leads me to believe that the speed limit is only there so the police have a reason to pull over anyone without any other reason. Don't like the look of the driver? Pull them over, while ignoring ever…

It's even worse in some places. Here in Atlanta, there is a law against impeding the flow of traffic. The I-285 perimeter highway around the city has a posted speed of 55 for most of it, yet traffic constantly flows at about 70-80mph. Theoretically, if you are going 65mph in the leftmost lane while people are flying around you and backed up behind you, you can be stopped and cited for both impeding the flow of traffic and speeding.

Who knows if it would get thrown out in court, but most people plead guilty to traffic citations by just paying the fine anyway, and the system knows that.

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#65

Post by Zikes »

anonbanker wrote: post #56
ithought wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, the Constitution doesn't grant rights. Do you have a natural right to be left alone if you so choose? Do you have a natural right to not be a witness against yourself? It seems a society based on popular sovereignty should define these rights as inherent and innate to being a person. And if you do assert your Constitutional rights, it's an easy way to escalate a situation where you soon learn the meaning t…

Asserting your rights is a fantastic ride, if you know how to do it. Everyone should Google how Geithner beat both rap and ride from the NYPD in four hours.that guy's a pro. If you don't know how to properly assert your rights, then you have none; expect to have your window smashed in, and be pulled out of your car. Or have cops and social workers come to remove your kids from an "unsafe" house 30 minutes after the p…

That sounds like a terrifyingly bleak way to live.

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#66

Post by mcherm »

anonbanker wrote: post #63
mcherm wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have absolutely no idea what you are trying to say. It sounds like you are implying that keeping mum is legally equivalent to agreeing to anything that a police officer says. That simply isn't true. If you have something useful to contribute, please make it more clear and include a citation somewhat more precise than "somewhere within the 2052 pages of Black's Law Dictionary".

Interesting quote you put there. Did I say that? But sure, i'll be happy to do your homework for you. Grab your book, an look up the following words: "You" "Right" "Remain" "Silent" "Attorney" "Afford" "Understand" Those would probably be a good start for you. You'll learn they don't mean what you think they mean. Afterwards, might I suggest a book on offer and acceptance? The "Examples and Explanations" series has a…

> Interesting quote you put there. Did I say that?

No. I used the quotation marks to indicate my paraphrasing of what I believed you were implying, not your actual words.

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#67

Post by bagels »

anonbanker wrote: post #56
ithought wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course, the Constitution doesn't grant rights. Do you have a natural right to be left alone if you so choose? Do you have a natural right to not be a witness against yourself? It seems a society based on popular sovereignty should define these rights as inherent and innate to being a person. And if you do assert your Constitutional rights, it's an easy way to escalate a situation where you soon learn the meaning t…

Asserting your rights is a fantastic ride, if you know how to do it. Everyone should Google how Geithner beat both rap and ride from the NYPD in four hours.that guy's a pro. If you don't know how to properly assert your rights, then you have none; expect to have your window smashed in, and be pulled out of your car. Or have cops and social workers come to remove your kids from an "unsafe" house 30 minutes after the p…

Do you have a link to a story? A cursory search reveals people complaining about being duped by a video that was posted two years after some event.

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#68

Post by morganvachon »

phkahler wrote: post #23

"Sir, can you tell me how fast you were going?" I've always wondered what the best answer would be.

Maybe it's a regional thing, but around here the question is always "Do you know why I pulled you over?" to which I've answered, "no, sir." To answer anything else is to incriminate yourself, and officers will write in the comments section of the ticket (for the judge to see) that you affirmed your offense, essentially pleading guilty on the spot.

For example, let's say you're going 10mph over the speed limit and you're aware of that, but you don't know your tail light is out. The officer pulls you over for the tail light, asks the question, and you answer "because I was speeding, I guess". Now he can not only write you the ticket for the tail light, but you just gave him a confession for the speeding too. Now you've guaranteed that you'll get two citations when you might have just gotten off with a "fix that tail light" warning.

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#69

Post by anonbanker »

bagels wrote: post #67
anonbanker wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asserting your rights is a fantastic ride, if you know how to do it. Everyone should Google how Geithner beat both rap and ride from the NYPD in four hours.that guy's a pro. If you don't know how to properly assert your rights, then you have none; expect to have your window smashed in, and be pulled out of your car. Or have cops and social workers come to remove your kids from an "unsafe" house 30 minutes after the p…

Do you have a link to a story? A cursory search reveals people complaining about being duped by a video that was posted two years after some event.

Forgive the lack of a link. This was discussed at a lunch with fellow bankers a few years back, and one of my acquaintances had a rather detailed run-down. I figure it was more publically-discussed. As I have no citation, take this with as large a grain of salt as you'd like. :-)

Re: 'You Have the Right to Remain Silent.' or Do You?

#70

Post by anonbanker »

Zikes wrote: post #65
anonbanker wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Asserting your rights is a fantastic ride, if you know how to do it. Everyone should Google how Geithner beat both rap and ride from the NYPD in four hours.that guy's a pro. If you don't know how to properly assert your rights, then you have none; expect to have your window smashed in, and be pulled out of your car. Or have cops and social workers come to remove your kids from an "unsafe" house 30 minutes after the p…

That sounds like a terrifyingly bleak way to live.

It's only bleak if you lose. :-)
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