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Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

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21–30 of 61 posts

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#21
It's economics. If I buy half a gallon of half and half, I know full well I don't need half a gallon for my coffee before it spoils.

I estimate that between 40% and 0% of it will be wasted on average depending on how many weeks it lasts in the fridge. But if I compare it to buying a quart, a quart will cost me around $2.49 while half a gallon would cost me $3.79

This means that for a cost of $3.79 I get to use 0.4 gallons on average, while for $4.98 I get to use 0.5 gallons (assuming a quart never expires, which isn't true, I've had a quart go bad after a little over a week)

This means that for 0.4 gallons buying quart by quart I have to pay 3.98, but buying half a gallon I pay less. So my strategy is then to buy quarts when they're on sale (when I can get them for $1.99) and half a gallon when I have no discount.

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#22
Even if you ignore the symbolism of throwing food while people still die of hunger, I am surprised by the "so what?" reaction of this crowd. Isn't YC about improving efficiencies? Yes there is waste elsewhere, the average server utilization in a data center is 12% but that's one reason the cloud came along with a 60% utilization (see http://www.boozallen.com/media/file/Economics-of-Cloud-Compu...) and new technologies like Docker will likely make that even higher.

So instead of saying "So what?" shouldn't we say: "we can do better and this is a business opportunity"?

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#23

Tentatively - this might not really be much of a problem? In many situations, we deliberately make sure we have excess capacity because it's better to have too much than too little. For example, I have a server running idle most of the time, but it's available to pick up a large long-running task when a user requests it. Analogously, when catering for an event, people often aim to have more than enough food for almos…

calorie reduction diet has been shown to drastically extend lifespan of rats. people are reporting the same thing as well. bodies run more efficiently.

also can't there be a compost program for mixed food? i mean we compost compostable stuff and mulch make things grow in our garden very well. I think the city was going to even collect organic waste use for citywide processing and composting to be used on city grounds. this could be a boon to replacement of fertilizers and move towards self sustainability.

my 2c

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#24

Tentatively - this might not really be much of a problem? In many situations, we deliberately make sure we have excess capacity because it's better to have too much than too little. For example, I have a server running idle most of the time, but it's available to pick up a large long-running task when a user requests it. Analogously, when catering for an event, people often aim to have more than enough food for almos…

Basically, yes. In developed countries we spend a historically small percentage of our income on food, because food is cheap and abundant.

Meanwhile, as you say, the problem with starvation is a lack of purchasing power. Amartya Sen won a Nobel prize for showing this, in fact. Over and over we see regions with famines exporting food, not importing food; Sen initially showed this was the case for the Bengal Famine of 1943, but it has been seen many times. People think the Irish potato famine was all about potato blight, but to quote Wikipedia "Records show Irish lands exported food even during the worst years of the Famine" and "Ireland exported approximately thirty to fifty shiploads per day to Britain, which was more than enough to feed the population." The same pattern has shown up in Africa over, and over, and over, for example in the Somali famine of 1981, or the Somali famine of 2001.

(This is also why food aid to stricken regions so frequently makes things worth. Donate a few hundred tons of food, and the market for food in the region crashes. Good for the urban poor; terrible for the rural farmers and pastoralists who are usually the primary victims of a famine. Worse, "death spirals" have been documented where the price of cows drops so low that farmers can no longer afford to feed them, and end up having to slaughter them all, just as the market price is at the lowest. Then when food prices recover, the herds are dead and the farmers are bankrupt, and can afford neither food nor new cows. And the famine keeps on rolling.)

In short: You're right. Food wastage in America has no impact overseas.

Edit: There's also some political issues. India is currently fighting tooth and nail to protect the millions of small grocers and shopkeepers from the international supermarkets and "big box" retailers. India points out—correctly—that if WalMart or its kin come in, many of those small shopkeepers will lose their jobs. Economists point out—correctly—that the existing system is horrifically inefficient. For the system as a whole, those jobs are a massive cost centre, begging to be rationalised with automated warehouses, containerization, RFID tags, the whole 9 yards, instead of the archaic, expensive, inefficient system now that wastes so much of what passes through it through wastage, overheads, spoilage, etc. The same fight is also brewing over farming; peasant farmers are horrifically expensive and inefficient, but while a few mega farms could produce several times as much food for less total cost, they would do so with a tiny fraction of the manpower. And the urban jobs for the peasant farmers do not exist, and throwing them out of work would be a humanitarian disaster which the Indian government is not equipped to deal with. And so on. Food is cheap and abundant in the West as part of a massive system of technology and infrastructure; as much as we might wish otherwise, it cannot be easily grafted onto a non-Western society without major changes which Africa and India, at least, are not yet able to embrace.

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#25
post #6
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anaerobic decomposition releases methane, which is about the worst possible configuration for your carbon and hydrogen atoms from a greenhouse effect point of view. Releasing the equivalent in carbon dioxide + water vapour (by letting it decompose somewhere with oxygen available - or equivalently by burning it or having animals eat it) would be far less damaging.

Anaerobic -- so, composting it would not produce methane?

burn the methane?

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#26
post #8
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About 7 years ago I remember in Australia we had a couple of bad years of drought and there was a food shortage. I remember reading in the paper that this would put the cost of food up, in some cases because we would be importing but in other cases becasue of the simple fact that when things are scarce they cost more. What was really striking to me is that no-one was going to go hungry - we weren't going to run out o…

The reason you didn't starve wasn't that people just wasted less, but also that you had the capacity to import. The economy that you so hate is what prevented you from starving in the first place. The countries that experience hunger are either too poor to afford imports or involved in a conflict.

If Australia didn't have the economic capacity to import there may have been a shortage to the extent that some poeple would have starved, but what would that really look like? Expensive food. Rich people wouldn't starve.

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#27

Tentatively - this might not really be much of a problem? In many situations, we deliberately make sure we have excess capacity because it's better to have too much than too little. For example, I have a server running idle most of the time, but it's available to pick up a large long-running task when a user requests it. Analogously, when catering for an event, people often aim to have more than enough food for almos…

calorie reduction diet has been shown to drastically extend lifespan of rats. people are reporting the same thing as well. bodies run more efficiently. also can't there be a compost program for mixed food? i mean we compost compostable stuff and mulch make things grow in our garden very well. I think the city was going to even collect organic waste use for citywide processing and composting to be used on city grounds…

> also can't there be a compost program for mixed food?

Aren't there? I don't know how it looks in the US, but half the municipalities in Sweden collect food waste along with the recycling, turning it into natural gas, fertilizer and electricity/heat. http://matavfall.vasyd.se/media/2187/matavfallsprocess.pdf

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#28
post #22

Even if you ignore the symbolism of throwing food while people still die of hunger, I am surprised by the "so what?" reaction of this crowd. Isn't YC about improving efficiencies? Yes there is waste elsewhere, the average server utilization in a data center is 12% but that's one reason the cloud came along with a 60% utilization (see http://www.boozallen.com/media/file/Economics-of-Cloud-Compu... ) and new technologi…

There's not much business opportunity in people who don't have money.

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#29
Food production has become cheap and efficient. So efficient in fact, that it has apparently no significant economic impact if "as much as 40 percent of America's food supply ends up in a dumpster". Otherwise, the market would improve efficiency with regards to wasting all that food.

I find particularly appalling that the production of animal products has become so economical that it does not matter that so much is thrown away. Efficient meat production means of course factory farming and questionable treatment of animals. This is a problem. The other problem is with the consumers of such cheap animal products. They are not aware anymore, have no respect for the fact that the thing they just gobbled up (and threw away) was once a living breathing being. It is sad.

Re: Americans throw out more food than plastic, paper, metal, and glass

#30
post #6
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anaerobic decomposition releases methane, which is about the worst possible configuration for your carbon and hydrogen atoms from a greenhouse effect point of view. Releasing the equivalent in carbon dioxide + water vapour (by letting it decompose somewhere with oxygen available - or equivalently by burning it or having animals eat it) would be far less damaging.

Anaerobic -- so, composting it would not produce methane?

Assuming you turn the compost regularly, it's an aerobic process. However, if you build the heap too high, and/or it gets too wet, and/or you don't turn it often enough, it can go anaerobic. I believe that's unlikely to happen on a homeowner scale, and presumably at municipal scale they'll have industrial infrastructure to turn it regularly until it has finished decomposing.
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