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Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

c9x.me

21–30 of 55 posts

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#21
I hope the author of Edit is reading this thread. This sounds like a dream come true! The best form of encouragement is people using the software, but if the author wants us to wait, I'm cool with that - but I hope they make real progress quickly!

Now I have the itch to fire up and work in Acme again :)

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#23
post #10
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Excellent points. Monocultures are terribly harmful, especially in the open-source side of things. While github is convenient, it's not the right answer for a lot of things and terribly inconvenient for others. I use git without github. I use it with vim outliner and keep the issues in the repo.

You use vim outliner plugin for the issues? How does that work? Are your issues simple text files describing it? In a "issues" folder? Do you enforce a format? How do you track their status?

Yes. Indent per issue. One .otl file with all issues in it. No format enforced although I'm pretty consistent at writing issues. Once complete the issue is simply deleted. I've done this up to 4 people and it has worked wonderfully even though they had to learn vim :)

You can pipe it through awk to remove any lines starting with a space/tab, sort it then then diff the result with earlier versions to work out progress etc as well.

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#24
post #19
post #17

For people not familiar with Acme, I found this 20-minute video tour very informative: http://research.swtch.com/acme

Also, I asked HN about modern Acme clones recently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8269442 (glad this came along)

How about these (may have been mentioned on HN already, but not in response to your question):

minime: http://daten.dieweltistgarnichtso.net/src/minime/README, also http://blog.dieweltistgarnichtso.net/minime-a-minimalist-uni...

JaKme: https://code.google.com/p/jakme/

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#25
post #5
post #3

Very nice. Wish it was on Github for easier contributing (and issue tracking).

>easier contributing Er... what? What's hard about contributing? You don't have to go through a web interface for everything? IMHO that makes it easier. $ git clone git://c9x.me/ed.git $ git format-patch --cover-letter $ git send-email `man git send-email` will tell you anything you need to know: configuration options, examples... If is well-written and straightforward! Seems like the author isn't interested in publi…

While I'm all for not standardizing on github, git send-email doesn't actually work.

First off, your assumption that people use the command line to interact with git is no longer correct. While that was true when I started using git, that's no longer a requirement for basic usage.

Next, perhaps as a corallary, many computer users don't have local email working, ie 'mail user@example.com' on the command line doesn't work. This means that git send-email also won't work.

Sad to say, but getting git send-email working is (unfortunately) beyond some people (as is getting a working 'tar' command line sans Google, apparently).

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#26
post #8

Looks like there are some differences with vi, among others: * "dd" is not implemented, use "d_" * "cw" will not work as in vi, use "ce" or "cl" * "r" is not implemented, use "cl" I think these are very common mnemonics, so I wonder why they are not implemented and if there are any plans to do it in the future. I use these all the time, so this would be a major turnoff for me.

Because they are not very reasonable? * "dd" isn't reasonable because it violates the "command + movement/region" structure of vi commands. So is "cc" and "yy". None of "c d y" is not a movement or region. Presumably in this editor "_" represents the "whole line" region, which leads to also "c_" and "y_". Much more regular although it does require you to lift your finger one more time. * "cw" isn't reasonable because…

'"cw" isn't reasonable because "w" as a movement usually means "to the next word", but in "cw" it means "to the end of current word" instead. "ce" is indeed better.'

I've recently been noticing this - dw behaves like dw, but cw behaves like ce and there's no way to express a real cw in a short number of keystrokes. Despite it breaking my muscle memory, I believe I approve of this change.

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#27
post #14
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because they are not very reasonable? * "dd" isn't reasonable because it violates the "command + movement/region" structure of vi commands. So is "cc" and "yy". None of "c d y" is not a movement or region. Presumably in this editor "_" represents the "whole line" region, which leads to also "c_" and "y_". Much more regular although it does require you to lift your finger one more time. * "cw" isn't reasonable because…

dd, cc and yy violate that pattern of vi commands, but they form their own pattern. (g~~ is another instance of it.) I agree that cw violates a pattern, but I think it's a reasonable violation. (Not necessarily good, but reasonable.

Given that you can get cw behavior with ce, I don't really think the original breaking of cw was reasonable (though I expect it went the other way and cw existed before vi settled into its current verb-noun philosophy).

I agree with you on the doublings - probably makes most sense to preserve them.

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#29
post #19
post #17

For people not familiar with Acme, I found this 20-minute video tour very informative: http://research.swtch.com/acme

Also, I asked HN about modern Acme clones recently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=8269442 (glad this came along)

I'm the developer of plan9-for-vimspace[1], which you mentioned in your thread. I've not been very active with it, because I came up against some limitations in vim, but I really want to go further with it.

I would really like some feedback on what stuff should go in or out. I've thought a lot on how to implement acme's tag lines and a plumber system (just this weekend, I was thinking of providing a fuse-based system for that).

[1] https://github.com/fmoralesc/plan9-for-vimspace

Re: Edit: A Relaxing Mix of Vi and Acme

#30
That's neat, it reminds me of MPW and the scheme interpreter I used long ago on a mac, wish I could remember which one now. They had a worksheet where you could go back to a previous line with the keyboard or mouse and hit enter there (or edit it first and hit enter then) to execute. I had a very nice worksheet with lots of templates I would follow.
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