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A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

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Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#111

Post by wbhart »

dceddia wrote: post #96
bocalogic wrote: post #77

I respect Rand and give him a lot of credit for vocalizing his challenges. Depression is a challenge and it can be overcome. I am not a doctor, but I can tell you that a lot of my peers are suffering from depression from business, marriage or just in general. One thing I do know is that the world has changed a lot in the past decade. The price of everything just keeps going up and we are constantly bombarded by infor…

You mentioned staying off caffeine, but recommended teas that both (usually) contain caffeine. Not trying to be a jerk, but genuinely curious - is the caffeine from tea better for the body than the caffeine from coffee? Or did you mean decaffeinated types of tea?

I also agree with the caffeine thing. The reason I stay off it is not so much the immediate effect of caffeine on anxiety (I find none), but because caffeine increases mania. Ultimately mania (dealing with life frantically) causes the nervous system to respond poorly. And anxiety seems to be above all a disproportionate reaction of the sympathetic nervous system. There is also an effect on sleep regulation and a hard edge to withdrawal that can exacerbate anxiety. Incidentally, chocolate contains a related compound, but not caffeine itself. I've experimented with chocolate over what I would consider to be statistically significant periods of time, and I honestly couldn't detect any effect in moderation. Your mileage may vary.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#112

Post by wbhart »

autism_hurts wrote: post #70

I cannot stress how much exercising to exhaustion daily (read: Crossfit) and eating healthy (Slow Carb / Paleo) impacted my depression. Please try them before you medicate.

Aerobic exercise is also great for anxiety disorders, but it is important to note that exercise to exhaustion can severely complicate anxiety, as opposed to depression. The reason is that it stresses the nervous system (producing excess cortisol) and ultimately intensifies anxiety attacks. The same goes for anaerobic exercise. It's equivalent to exercising to exhaustion, at even moderate intensity.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#113

Post by wbhart »

zentiggr wrote: post #9
swombat wrote: post #6

Forgive my ignorance and bluntness, but reading the above, it sounds more like an anxiety disorder than like depression. Both are serious, but I'm not sure if it helps to confuse the two? I've not experienced either seriously, but I know people who have. Depression seems to be more about things not mattering anymore, everything being pointless, the world seeming drab and just not fun anymore, rather than feeling that…

This suddenly feels way too familiar. Thanks for writing this - and I think I'm going to try going decaf for a couple of weeks and see whether or not my anxiety eases.

You need something like 14 days for caffeine withdrawal to cease (during which anxiety may temporarily increase). And any effect from changing things about might take weeks to have an effect on anxiety (perhaps up to 6-12 weeks). Exercise (if tolerated) can have an effect in about two hours, and I've read papers which suggest some prescribed (and indicated) medications can have an effect in around 3 hours. But withdrawing stimulants such as caffeine, although essential to long term recovery, generally doesn't have a sudden effect. Similarly, some standard treatments for anxiety actually increase symptoms in the short term (e.g. patients who were given sedative antihistamines in the past, which are no longer recommended as a treatment, used to be advised that their symptoms may initially increase).

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#114

Post by tomsthumb »

dfc wrote: post #59
l33tbro wrote: post #43

As somebody who is not depressed, it is always confronting to see just how hard depressed people are on themselves.

Is confronting the word you meant to use? It does not make much sense in this context. But the alternative explanation is that an attempt at "comforting" was auto-corrected to confronting. But being "comforted" by another person's sadness makes it appear that you are a "less than virtuous and decent" person and that does not seem like something you would want to advertise.

His writing style suggests either he's dyslexic or that English isn't his first language.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#115

Post by wbhart »

bhouston wrote: post #18
swombat wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, that paragraph sounds like anxiety to me - why does it sound like depression to you?

This is classic depression: > But depressed Rand magnifies the bad 10X and minimizes the good. You find that in descriptions of depression: http://www.helpguide.org/mental/depression_signs_types_diagn... (e.g. "you feel hopeless and helpless." "you can’t control your negative thoughts, no matter how much you try.") You do not find that in descriptions of anxiety: http://www.webmd.com/anxiety-panic/guide/mental-health…

The "doom/dread" spoken of is not the doom/dread you are associating it with. Anxiety disorder (regular panic attacks) absolutely comes with a sudden feeling of impending doom/dread. That is its most characteristic trait!

Sufferers of panic disorder sometimes feel so convinced they are going to die imminently they end up in the emergency room, only to be told there is nothing physically wrong and that they are suffering a panic attack.

And generalised anxiety can result in a fairly consistent state of anxiety about things with a vague sense of impending doom.

I agree panic attacks are not a constant feeling of doom/dread. They have a sudden onset and usually pass within minutes (though can reoccur regularly for hours or longer when unmanaged). This can then be followed by a constant jitteriness, even shaking, feeling weak and feeling anxious for days or even weeks following a bad attack.

Also, anxiety attacks are not necessarily triggered by drugs/caffeine or a trigger situation. They can occur completely randomly when perfectly calm and relaxed and not thinking about anything in particular.

I also agree anxiety is very distinct from depression. But the two often occur together.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#116

Post by jroseattle »

I read through this and the Can't Sleep/Loop post, which had me wiping my eyes. I feel I'm there, right now.

We're in the middle of raising money, while I also keep the engineering ship moving forward with product releases. We're about to run out of initial seed money, as we were supposed to have brought in the balance of the round and been on to Series A at this point. It's challenging, but I feel like I'm handling it.

Or so I thought. It turns out, I'm getting little sleep right now -- maybe 4-5 hours a night, on average. I've gained back so much weight and I abhor seeing myself in photos. I watch colleagues take absurd plans to investors and get way overfunded, more than they were ever asking to take on, while our little operation that's actually generating revenue (we will likely be break-even in 6 months) gets passed. I know it's not a rational reaction, but still the mental headwinds it creates really sap my soul.

It sucks when you're a (very) logical being, and something in your head no longer fits into place. I'm short with my kids at home, and I literally dread downtime. I find that cocktails go down easy, really easy.

It's a loop, alright.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#117

Post by l33tbro »

31reasons wrote: post #84
l33tbro wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Please just takes some risks. Honestly, bold moves is what lifted me from a similar state. I'd been diagnosed and was living at home with my folks. But picking up and forcing myself into new situations is what lifted me out. Don't worry about the fact that you're 30 and never had a GF. Honestly, it doesn't matter. I'm 33 and my GF is my first and she doesn't give a fuck. All she cares about is that I'm honest and tha…

>>get on something like Tinder and start getting pussy again just for your self esteem and self worth. I appreciate you helping here but i would disagree with this statement. This could be a recipe for disaster and lot of mind fuck. Never ever base your self esteem and self worth on how much sex you are getting and from what type of women.

I'm not saying it is the only thing to base self esteem on. But sex, almost universally enhances quality of life and self-worth, unless you identify as asexual or enjoy being alone (which it didn't sound like it to me). My point was that the hangup of not having had a GF should not be something that people should feel shame for.

I agree though. I think Tinder can be terrible for people's self worth. Meaningless sex can be really destructive. But it sounds like meh_master isn't meeting people - and I think Tinder is a good way for people just to connect (even if it doesn't lead to hooking up). Just trying to help a guy out who seems to be looking for some answers and is in a pretty lonely place :(

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#118

Post by gregpilling »

gadders wrote: post #68
gregpilling wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would bet that many people on HN have some sorts of manic depressive tendencies. I fit that myself.

A friend of the family had that. She is an entirely sensible, respectable mother and worker, but when she is in a manic phase... It must be hard to find yourself doing things so out of your usual character.

I kind of like the manic part. I get so much done. The depressed part I don't like.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#119

Post by neurotech1 »

swombat wrote: post #6

Forgive my ignorance and bluntness, but reading the above, it sounds more like an anxiety disorder than like depression. Both are serious, but I'm not sure if it helps to confuse the two? I've not experienced either seriously, but I know people who have. Depression seems to be more about things not mattering anymore, everything being pointless, the world seeming drab and just not fun anymore, rather than feeling that…

Anxiety and Depression often go together. There are neurophysiological reasons for this. I found that lack of quality sleep, energy drinks and prozac was a really bad combination.

Note: I'm not a physician and this is not medical advice. I have experienced more than a few medical misadventures along the way.

Re: A Long, Ugly Year of Depression That’s Finally Fading

#120

Post by dfc »

tomsthumb wrote: post #114
dfc wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is confronting the word you meant to use? It does not make much sense in this context. But the alternative explanation is that an attempt at "comforting" was auto-corrected to confronting. But being "comforted" by another person's sadness makes it appear that you are a "less than virtuous and decent" person and that does not seem like something you would want to advertise.

His writing style suggests either he's dyslexic or that English isn't his first language.

He seems to reside in .au and has a decent command of English idioms. Quotes like the following lead me to believe he is simply a little "less than classy and virtuous."

   Dont be  a depressed waste  of space like I  was...Id even
   get on something like Tinder and start getting pussy again
   just for your self esteem and self worth.
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