Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative • Hacker News Board

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#141

Post by duckmysick » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 1:34 PM UTC

exodust wrote: post #139

brianzelip wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

@exodust I'm interested in digging into _with the grain_ web authoring as you say. Checked your profile but didn't find any links. Can you pass some along to share the approach?

I'll hold off sharing links but will give you something much better... my approach and whacky theories. TL;DR - I focus on the creative layout potential of html documents. I avoid abstraction layers that force dependencies between unrelated components that may inhibit layout control and design. To use css grid frameworks in production is to me like leaving the scaffolding on permanently and calling it a feature of th…

Sharing an approach and "whacky theories" isn't better than simply showing your work. If it's truly as good as you describe, it will stand on its own feet.

Unless it's something your client doesn't wish to share I don't see why you're secretive about your work. Looking at your post it seems you're very proud of your creations.

And while using grid frameworks is restrictive it's absolutely not like leaving the scaffolding on permanently. If you do that it's immediately visible by any passer-byes. Layperson visitors will have zero idea that a particular grid framework was used even if they viewed a source code.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#142

Post by franciscop » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 7:22 PM UTC

gioele wrote: post #121

franciscop wrote: post #2

I've tried to keep it as tiny as possible with just under 3kb when gzipped. What would you change? What would you add? Any feedback or pull request is greatly welcome! MIT Licensed

My suggestion is to make picnic work with `label` elements that are outside the `input` they related to. In other words, the CSS should work for this HTML Checkable instead of the unidiomatic (and broken from the POW of accessibility) Checkable

This was considered, but I decided against it in the end. However, I've found a solution that would work with both html and will upload it soon.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#143

Post by franciscop » Wed, Sep 17, 2014, 7:29 PM UTC

desireco42 wrote: post #100

franciscop wrote: post #2

I've tried to keep it as tiny as possible with just under 3kb when gzipped. What would you change? What would you add? Any feedback or pull request is greatly welcome! MIT Licensed

Here is the thing I would like and maybe I could fork your and just try it and see how it looks. I really like attribute based properties for grid, I think this is great idea. Check it here. I think this could make your framework different from me-too frameworks. I think you could improve on it quite a bit, add optional modules for modal for example, maybe some other elements. http://glenmaddern.com/articles/introduc…

I don't really like the style. However, I take a note about it, thank you for the suggestion.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#144

Post by mvkel » Thu, Sep 18, 2014, 8:15 PM UTC

Overall, this speaks more to an engineer's obsession with size reduction than true design principles.

The animated buttons are a distraction, especially.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#145

Post by computerjunkie » Thu, Sep 18, 2014, 10:21 PM UTC

welly wrote: post #117

computerjunkie wrote: post #65

I tried using Bootstrap and other CSS frameworks and (as mentioned in the comments) I felt like I was fighting the frameworks to get it to do what I wanted to do. The problem with CSS frameworks is that they are invasive when it comes to writing semantic HTML. As someone who is working on developing semantic HTML and improving the skill, its annoying when you use a CSS framework which it encourages you to perform inl…

Where's the inline styling used in Semantic UI? I'm looking and looking and see no inline styling in their examples.

Have a look here [0]on their documentation on buttons, also in their divider documentation[1].

0. http://semantic-ui.com/elements/button.html 1. http://semantic-ui.com/elements/divider.html

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#146

Post by wuliwong » Sun, Sep 21, 2014, 12:52 AM UTC

franciscop wrote: post #130

wuliwong wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wanted to hate on it but I dunno, I might give it a spin. :) I'm mainly interested in your grid naming conventions, as the become very cumbersome in bootstrap. One thing I didn't see was the ability to add offsets to a grid item?

It was the first time I wrote a grid so they're not perfect nor complete. If you feel inclined, please submit the suggestion in ( https://github.com/picnicss/picnic/issues ) or feel free to push the edit.

nah, i'll just use bootstrap then.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#147

Post by exodust » Mon, Sep 22, 2014, 9:28 AM UTC

duckmysick wrote: post #141

exodust wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll hold off sharing links but will give you something much better... my approach and whacky theories. TL;DR - I focus on the creative layout potential of html documents. I avoid abstraction layers that force dependencies between unrelated components that may inhibit layout control and design. To use css grid frameworks in production is to me like leaving the scaffolding on permanently and calling it a feature of th…

Sharing an approach and "whacky theories" isn't better than simply showing your work. If it's truly as good as you describe, it will stand on its own feet. Unless it's something your client doesn't wish to share I don't see why you're secretive about your work. Looking at your post it seems you're very proud of your creations. And while using grid frameworks is restrictive it's absolutely not like leaving the scaffol…

I'll codepen it sometime, as things should be clean to demo specific structure approaches. The corporate clutter that sits on top and within the pages I make may confuse analysis of the core point I'm getting at.

Besides, the website look and feel and even the way it responds is only a fraction of the point. Maintenance, expandability, developer accessibility, technical debt, complexity, dependencies, workflow. All come into play when it comes time to meet the brief, which might come from someone with big visual curvy, crunchy ideas and lots of money.

I'm not trying to sell you something, duckmysick. I'm rationalising my technical method which doesn't involve grids - even if the designer has used one. I understand I can't qualify anything here, I'm cool with that... just chattin. I'll make a note to send and add to my profile a a codepen of what I'm talking about. It's a template I like to call... it has no name because it's just HTML and CSS! Whoever made HTML and CSS can take the credit.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#148

Post by duckmysick » Mon, Sep 22, 2014, 3:09 PM UTC

exodust wrote: post #147

duckmysick wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sharing an approach and "whacky theories" isn't better than simply showing your work. If it's truly as good as you describe, it will stand on its own feet. Unless it's something your client doesn't wish to share I don't see why you're secretive about your work. Looking at your post it seems you're very proud of your creations. And while using grid frameworks is restrictive it's absolutely not like leaving the scaffol…

I'll codepen it sometime, as things should be clean to demo specific structure approaches. The corporate clutter that sits on top and within the pages I make may confuse analysis of the core point I'm getting at. Besides, the website look and feel and even the way it responds is only a fraction of the point. Maintenance, expandability, developer accessibility, technical debt, complexity, dependencies, workflow. All c…

I'm fine with that. I'm not the kind of person who takes everything at face value. While written rationalization work on me to a certain point (you did intrigue me with your approach) I need to see, hear, touch, look under the hood, view the source, run a simulation, and play with a "thing" to be fully convinced.

But that's just me talking and it's selfish. If it works for you then it's fantastic! I'll keep an eye on your codepen because I'm still curious.

Re: Show HN: Picnic.css, a lightweight Bootstrap alternative

#149

Post by franciscop » Mon, Sep 29, 2014, 7:11 PM UTC

wuliwong wrote: post #146

franciscop wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was the first time I wrote a grid so they're not perfect nor complete. If you feel inclined, please submit the suggestion in ( https://github.com/picnicss/picnic/issues ) or feel free to push the edit.

nah, i'll just use bootstrap then.

ok