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I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

erenyagdiran.github.io

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Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe it was also the part of the key.

Could you change the jmp into a nop, then xor every nth byte of the program with jmp xor nop, where n = whatever offset the jmp was at in the key? The result should be a valid decryption.

I see. That would work I suppose, but at that time I couldn't think of this.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#102

Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates. It scales well (you don't have to spend personal hours on them) and you get real information. This applies even to sysadmins. We have a favourite: set up a VM with a slightly-broken application in a slightly-broken Apache and Tomcat, and get them to ssh in and document the process of fixing it. Even people who aren't a full bottle on Tomcat will give useful i…

I have mixed feelings about this sort of thing.

As an interviewer I've done something like this when needing to hire for a very straightforward job with very little time and an effectively endless supply of candidates.

This addressed the problem of our time crunch, but I doubt it helped the selection process overall.

I think this sort of testing is subject to all the same issues as most any other method of interviewing, but limited to a much smaller sample size.

Basically, it's arguably good for the interviewers and a coin flip for everyone else.

As an interviewee, I haven't encountered a test like this, but I expect my response would almost surely involve questioning the architecture decisions that led to such a problem in the first place.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#103

If we asked questions like that at our interviews, it would take us 10 years to hire one candidate. Most people fail at basic basic stuff.

Are you hiring security engineers? I would think stuff like this would be expected knowledge in the field.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's an effective strategy from the employer's side, but what about the applicant who is asked to spend hours on some test for every job he/she applies for? Are you paying these applicants for the time they spend jumping through these hoops? And if your "technical grilling" fails to identify strong candidates, you're obviously asking the wrong questions or, at the very least, not asking the right ones.

Nobody puts a gun to applicant's head and forces him to take a test, so... Business is not for people to have jobs but to make profit.

The point is that you'll only get applicants up to a certain level. Once an applicant has enough skill and knows it, and also values his time, he'll take one look at your 14 hour challenge and laugh.

So in the end you're only hurting yourself because you'll mostly get naive and easily manipulated people who are fine for the lower ranks but absolute poison once they move up. That's if they don't wise up and leave first, costing you time and effort to find and train replacements and scramble to rediscover and distribute the lost knowledge they left with.

But then again, such a long duration challenge is already very telling of the company culture. If you can't respect other peoples' time, then your company is already on shaky footing.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#105

Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates. It scales well (you don't have to spend personal hours on them) and you get real information. This applies even to sysadmins. We have a favourite: set up a VM with a slightly-broken application in a slightly-broken Apache and Tomcat, and get them to ssh in and document the process of fixing it. Even people who aren't a full bottle on Tomcat will give useful i…

Seems like this sort of test should be very effective at finding people who are already reasonably good at the job you're hiring for, but gives you little to no information about how quickly they learn, their willingness to try new things, etc.

Given how fast things change, even if you imagine the person staying for only a year or three, learning abilities are nontrivial.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#106
post #84

Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates. It scales well (you don't have to spend personal hours on them) and you get real information. This applies even to sysadmins. We have a favourite: set up a VM with a slightly-broken application in a slightly-broken Apache and Tomcat, and get them to ssh in and document the process of fixing it. Even people who aren't a full bottle on Tomcat will give useful i…

A nice simple test that I like to give as a first-wave elimination: Have a computer setup and running (all properly configured). Pull the network cable out of the jack a little bit (so it looks like it's plugged in but isn't). Ask the person being interviewed to show me an IP being used by microsoft or google. (so ping/dig/nslookup/etc) Let the person know that (a) the computer is in working condition (i.e. no driver…

If I answer without touching the computer, do I pass? :) Google DNS comes in handy!

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#107

Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates. It scales well (you don't have to spend personal hours on them) and you get real information. This applies even to sysadmins. We have a favourite: set up a VM with a slightly-broken application in a slightly-broken Apache and Tomcat, and get them to ssh in and document the process of fixing it. Even people who aren't a full bottle on Tomcat will give useful i…

> Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates

I agree, but only if you're allowed to use references/google/etc and given a reasonable amount of time to accomplish it. I've had a "real-life" test where I wasn't allowed to verify or look up information, or where I'm giving a very short time to execute, and I've always thought those were absurd.

The idea that you would ever have to do something like this in a bomb-diffusing type of scenario with no internet and a ticking clock, would only test if you have already solved the problem before, not whether you could investigate a new problem.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#108
post #9

> Here is the first thing i typed in the terminal root@lisa:~# ./CrackTheDoor Um. I see at least one security issue already.

Could have been a VM! I'd assume it was.

Or even a livecd with no other storage attached.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#109

Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates. It scales well (you don't have to spend personal hours on them) and you get real information. This applies even to sysadmins. We have a favourite: set up a VM with a slightly-broken application in a slightly-broken Apache and Tomcat, and get them to ssh in and document the process of fixing it. Even people who aren't a full bottle on Tomcat will give useful i…

I have mixed feelings about this sort of thing. As an interviewer I've done something like this when needing to hire for a very straightforward job with very little time and an effectively endless supply of candidates. This addressed the problem of our time crunch, but I doubt it helped the selection process overall. I think this sort of testing is subject to all the same issues as most any other method of interviewi…

Certainly, as user:psychometry pointed out also.

In this case, as a sysadmin I was pleased to be able to show my chops in a realistic test. And our previous hire was also quite pleased to get a real test. But of course, there is potential to abuse it.

Re: I was asked to crack a program in a job interview

#110

Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates. It scales well (you don't have to spend personal hours on them) and you get real information. This applies even to sysadmins. We have a favourite: set up a VM with a slightly-broken application in a slightly-broken Apache and Tomcat, and get them to ssh in and document the process of fixing it. Even people who aren't a full bottle on Tomcat will give useful i…

> Real-life tests are THE best thing to send job candidates I agree, but only if you're allowed to use references/google/etc and given a reasonable amount of time to accomplish it. I've had a "real-life" test where I wasn't allowed to verify or look up information, or where I'm giving a very short time to execute, and I've always thought those were absurd. The idea that you would ever have to do something like this i…

Yeah, this is an open-book test.

Of course, there's tests like user:B5Geek's, where the candidate gets a PC with a slightly-unplugged network cable and has to realise this fact.

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