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Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

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Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#41
post #30
post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe HN guidelines are to use the title from the source document. In this case, "Hemisphere Synopsis." Don't think that's much better.

When the document has more than one title, it makes sense to use the most informative one. The submitted title was "DO Not mention Hemisphere in any official reports or court documents". That broke the guidelines, certainly by being baity and arguably by editorializing as well.

The original title was a quote from page 13. A very interesting quote, but with very little context information.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#42

Sidebar: for all the ranting that deserves to be done here, it's also interesting to note that this was an internal IT program, like many other programs I suspect HN readers may have participated in. There was a help desk, a POC, a procedure to follow, and so on. They didn't want the average Law Enforcement schmuck calling operations! Instead you had to contact your POC. They were probably afraid of being overwheleme…

Yes, they met at a Holiday Inn, drank shitty coffee, ate stale donuts, some guy complained about video adapters, and then they spent the day discussing how to completely subvert the fourth amendment of the constitution.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#43
post #16
post #8

Our country is full of police departments that fund themselves through seizures of drug money, that they know about by using data our intelligence services collected on us. I wonder who's using the phone data to buy and sell stocks? Maybe that's what they'll get into once we legalize marijuana.

There are easier ways for the government to make money. There is a strong belief the CIA was selling drugs to citizens in the 80s to fund themselves [1] [1] http://www.justice.gov/oig/special/9712/ch01p1.htm

While this story may be true, it doesn't quite support 'There are easier ways for the government to make money.'

The CIA is very different from local law enforcement agencies, and they don't just rely on the material support of siezures of cash and other things which go to auction, but a substantial portion of all of their staffing budgets come from federal drug grants, which means that there are individuals who need to protect the drug war in order to protect their jobs.

There are scarcely easier ways for law enforcement to fund itself than to sieze cash from marijuana farmers and distributors. Even legalization campaigns to tax and regulate come across as shockingly close to protection schemes, since not supporting them is effectively supporting the continued risk of militarized police encounters.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#44
Doesn't surprise me at all. I've been subject to 'random physical search' in very unexpected situation, twice. Both of those cases were when I had been in (phone) contact in previous days with guys which phones were highly likely to be monitored by law enforcement. - Random isn't nearly as random, as you might think.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#45
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When the document has more than one title, it makes sense to use the most informative one. The submitted title was "DO Not mention Hemisphere in any official reports or court documents". That broke the guidelines, certainly by being baity and arguably by editorializing as well.

The original title was a quote from page 13. A very interesting quote, but with very little context information.

I know, but picking an arbitrary sentence to emphasize one tendentious point is a form of spin, and thus arguably editorializing.

In the absence of any good title, subtitle, or caption, it's ok to pick the sentence from the article that best and most neutrally represents it as a whole. But that is not the same thing.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#46
post #40

The simple truth is this: Anyone who supports the war on drugs as it is currently being run has abandoned what the US stood for at its founding regarding liberty, freedom, and the rule of law.

I prefer that rhetoric as follows. 'Anyone who supports the war on drugs has abandoned liberty and freedom.' Terms like "the rule of law" encourage a mentality that's unempathetic and unconcerned with many forms of tyranny and suffering. It encourages complicit behavior through blind allegiance and rhetoric. That allegiance will probably remain until the faithful are personally affected and destroyed by the rule of l…

> The largest atrocities and cruelest of societies may happen due to the rule of law.

I seem to recall these sorts of things being strongly correlated with secret police, etc, and not being in a society with stable laws that it adheres to.

Conflating secret law with law being the basis of our large scale interactions doesn't make for a strong argument, unless you can show that one necessitates the other.

Similarly, rule of law has nothing inherently nationalistic about it.

I'm curious what you'd propose as a stable large scale social structure that doesn't fundamentally depend on us establishing a mutual rulebook that we all agree to play by. I don't mean that sarcastically, I honestly want you to suggest one.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#48
post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I prefer that rhetoric as follows. 'Anyone who supports the war on drugs has abandoned liberty and freedom.' Terms like "the rule of law" encourage a mentality that's unempathetic and unconcerned with many forms of tyranny and suffering. It encourages complicit behavior through blind allegiance and rhetoric. That allegiance will probably remain until the faithful are personally affected and destroyed by the rule of l…

> The largest atrocities and cruelest of societies may happen due to the rule of law. I seem to recall these sorts of things being strongly correlated with secret police, etc, and not being in a society with stable laws that it adheres to. Conflating secret law with law being the basis of our large scale interactions doesn't make for a strong argument, unless you can show that one necessitates the other. Similarly, r…

Talking about the systemically brutal consequences of people who have blind allegiance to the rule of law is not equivalent to inferring that humanitarian law (e.g. Bill of Rights) shouldn't exist. It's not equivalent to saying law isn't useful. You're conflating or projecting these sentiments. Unfortunately, conflation like that is a common consequence of nationalism. People who find faults are often derided or willfully misinterpreted. I'm not accusing you of this. It's just a point.

> "I seem to recall these sorts of things being strongly correlated with secret police, etc, and not being in a society with stable laws that it adheres to."

Those societies didn't have "secret" police. They had police who operated (sometimes in secret) legally. Every nation is as fueled by law as the next group seeking legitimacy. This shouldn't be a point of contention. No one's conflating "secret law" with "law." In a land where "secret law" becomes increasingly legitimate, it becomes a fool's errand to stress over shallow semantics, as dire reality takes shape (e.g. a prison, surveillance, military economy legitimately escalating).

> "Similarly, rule of law has nothing inherently nationalistic about it."

Allegiance to "rule of law" is entirely nationalistic in this context of nations. I'm not talking about the 'laws' of physics. The violence that inherently serves as the foundation of all national laws isn't magic. Zeus and his jack-booted thugs aren't appearing out of the sky to magically enforce words written on paper. Maybe you're trying to say that one person's interpretation of a nation will vary from another person's interpretation and, therefore, this means that one particular nationalist is not the same as another particular nationalist in the same nation. That's true. Yet, it doesn't mean much. It's usually a source of delusion ultimately.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#49

It's chilling that they explicitly mention parallel construction on page 12: When a complete set of CDRs are subpoenaed from the carrier, then all memorialized references to relevant and pertinent calls can be attributed to the carrier's records, thus "walling off" the information obtained from Hemisphere. In other words, Hemisphere can easily be protected if it is used as a pointer system to uncover relevant numbers…

Here's the deal.

If you work for an agency like the NSA or ONDCP as either a contractor or a full-time employee, and you're aware of a program like this, and you do not act to disclose it to the press and/or subvert it, then...

Hell, I'm not even going to finish that thought. If I do, it will seem redundant to someone with a conscience, and legally actionable otherwise.

Re: Hemisphere Project Summary: Office of National Drug Control Policy [pdf]

#50
post #28
post #25

Can anyone help me with this most emphasized sentence, "Hemisphere is law enforcement sensitive!"... what is it supposed to mean?

Wikipedia has: "Limited Distribution, Proprietary, Originator Controlled, Law Enforcement Sensitive were designations the Pentagon attempted in 2011 to exempt from President Obama's Executive Order 13556" Executive Order 13556 "Controlled Unclassified Information" required a public registry of such information and that the registry and implementing directives would be available to the public.

woah, I hadn't even considered that the term has an explicit legal definition. Scary stuff. Protect and serve the people but do it behind closed doors because the people can't handle the truth, right? Problem is the people can't make an informed vote on something they don't know about. The line between democracy and fascism is a fine one and I feel more like our government's mission is creeping in a definite direction every time one of these stories comes to light. I thank the god I don't believe that there are real patriots in this world like Snowden and the EFF who are trying to put the power of the truth in the hands of the people.
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