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Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

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Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#161

Post by mncolinlee »

MCRed wrote: post #154
jdoliner wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that they can make this an eligibility criterion speaks to the fact that they're giving you something you'd otherwise pay $100,000 for. If this deal is somehow keeping startups outside the gate then said startups must really have been screwed 3 hours ago when this deal didn't even exist.

Nope. I would never pay $100k to Google as a startup, because there are more efficient ways to deploy that money. I would, however, consider taking $100k in free hosting from google as a startup because making it free eliminates the cost consideration in hosting choices. It's not keeping us out of the gate, it just that it reinforces the redefinition of startup to be "Silicon Valley VC type". EG: 37 Signals would nev…

If you're actually spending $100k on hosting, one would hope you're making at least ten times as much. Otherwise, your engine of growth is fundamentally broken and you need to pivot.

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#162

Post by wj »

MCRed wrote: post #155
wj wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Going through an accelerator mean you've "sold your soul"? That is a bit of a jump.

In a way it is. Accelerators have become two things: Pitch training camps and old-boys networks. The focus seems to be all about polishing a pitch, and faking stats for whatever part of your business needs to be faked to show traction of some kind, so that you can pitch to the old-boy network on demo day, get some money and go to work for the accelerators backers partners. Startups long ago stopped being about buildi…

I'm uncomfortable with your generalizations (though you did account for exceptions with your last sentence).

I guess I would not be so pessimistic and give founders the benefit of the doubt that they think they are building something innovative (a word that means different things to different people).

The summer YC class had a fusion startup and a fission startup if I recall correctly. That is innovation in my book. And I think most startups are trying to change the status quo even to a small extent.

And why does a startup even need to be innovative? In this great talk by the founder of Asana (http://ecorner.stanford.edu/authorMaterialInfo.html?mid=3117) the point was made that while they're not curing diseases their software helps the people that are stay organized and save time.

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#163

Post by claar »

ryanjshaw wrote: post #131
meowface wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is just Google's form of semi-automatic due diligence. Instead of them having to carefully vet each startup, determine that they're actually getting work done and are a real company and have at least some tiny bit of potential, they'll just defer to the accelerators and incubators to decide on that. Remember they're giving away $100,000 of credit for free, so they have to make sure it's not being squandered. I a…

OK how about they give away $95k of credit and spend the $5k difference on due diligence? Now obviously to some extent I'm being facetious as of course the economics don't work exactly like this, but Microsoft's BizSpark offers Azure credits and has managed to be free for years without abuse being a significant issue. It seems likely that if Google made available an offering of, say, $100/mo with strings similar to B…

Partly because $100k credit likely costs them $5k in the first place..

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#164

Post by nostrademons »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #134
jdoliner wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fact that they can make this an eligibility criterion speaks to the fact that they're giving you something you'd otherwise pay $100,000 for. If this deal is somehow keeping startups outside the gate then said startups must really have been screwed 3 hours ago when this deal didn't even exist.

This deal makes things worse for non accelerated/VC'd startups because now they're competing with companies who not only have funding but also have $100K in free hosting.

If a one-time $100K credit is the difference between success or failure in your business model, you have a pretty weak business model.

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#165

Post by jiggy2011 »

nostrademons wrote: post #164
jiggy2011 wrote: post #134

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This deal makes things worse for non accelerated/VC'd startups because now they're competing with companies who not only have funding but also have $100K in free hosting.

If a one-time $100K credit is the difference between success or failure in your business model, you have a pretty weak business model.

If you're trying to validate an idea, not having to worry about hosting costs for the first year or so could be a big deal. Especially if you're planning to sell out later to a larger company who has so much infrastructure already that hosting is practically free.

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#166

Post by skj »

brudgers wrote: post #157
skj wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just to reinforce this... (I am a Google Cloud Platform engineer) Google's internal data, which is mined (and audited), and the Cloud datacenters/data, are hosted entirely separately (though that's as much to protect us from you as you from us). We do not do anything with data stored by cloud platform customers.

What exactly prohibits the company for which you work from doing this, e.g. can you reference specific state or Federal laws or agency rules which prohibit this, or on the civil side, specific terms and conditions of the company's standard service contract? Absent these, what is the business case for providing this service at no cost to the qualified companies? As I indicated, I don't see a first order monetization s…

I don't know anything about the legal issues. I only know what our policies are. If you don't take my word for things, I won't be offended.

Regarding the business case, Google has a LOT of compute power. The cost of that compute power on the cloud platform is not the cost in hardware and electricity to Google, it also pays for the engineering. Whether or not people take up Google on the 100k offer, the engineering has been paid for, so really Google is only giving away the electricity and maintenance. I don't know (and if I did know I wouldn't say) how much of that 100k is actual realized cost for Google.

But however much it is, that is at most 100k of REALLY EXTREMELY WELL targeted advertising for the Google Cloud Platform. A customer that goes through 100k of Google compute resources in a year is likely one that would rather continue paying Google's competitive rates for the same services in the future.

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#167

Post by skj »

claar wrote: post #163
ryanjshaw wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK how about they give away $95k of credit and spend the $5k difference on due diligence? Now obviously to some extent I'm being facetious as of course the economics don't work exactly like this, but Microsoft's BizSpark offers Azure credits and has managed to be free for years without abuse being a significant issue. It seems likely that if Google made available an offering of, say, $100/mo with strings similar to B…

Partly because $100k credit likely costs them $5k in the first place..

If someone actually spends all 100k of the credit, there is no doubt that the electricity involved cost more than 5k. There are certainly margins, but if the margin was 95%, then as Bezos says, "Your margin is my opportunity."

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#168

Post by skj »

Kurtz79 wrote: post #75

Remember that you can start using the platform for free, today. They have free daily quotas (I know for certain in the case of GAE, but I believe for the other services as well), which are kind of low, but good enough for proofs of concept and prototyping. Still, this is a commercial product, and running it implies a cost to Google. Thinking that they would give away 100K worth of services to anybody that asks for it…

I don't believe there are any services other than GAE with free tiers.

Edit: someone mentioned bigquery, which I haven't verified but seems plausible.

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#169

Post by skj »

jastanton wrote: post #70
steakejjs wrote: post #35

My biggest objection is the "approved VC" rule. Being from Washington DC, if I were to create a startup and get funding, am I on the approved list? I doubt they would have heard of the VCs out here (I don't know of many tech VCs). Seems like it will be really easy for them just to pick big names, change/bend the rules for them to ensure they make a lot of money. It is good for their bottom line but bad for most out t…

Or you should just email them and state your case regardless of if you're on the list or not. Remember they are human beings on the receiving end of that email. I doubt they are getting swarmed by emails and wouldn't mind hearing from you. The worst thing that happens is they say no or ignore you and that's that.

> I doubt they are getting swarmed by emails

HAH!

> and wouldn't mind hearing from you.

Probably not :)

Re: Google Launches Cloud Platform for Startups

#170

Post by nostrademons »

jiggy2011 wrote: post #165
nostrademons wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a one-time $100K credit is the difference between success or failure in your business model, you have a pretty weak business model.

If you're trying to validate an idea, not having to worry about hosting costs for the first year or so could be a big deal. Especially if you're planning to sell out later to a larger company who has so much infrastructure already that hosting is practically free.

Hosting costs for validating an idea run about $10-20/month, not $10-20K/month. Get a shared webhost or VPS and run things on a single box. Even if you are using every programming productivity trick in the book (dynamic languages, 3rd party libraries, RDBMSes, etc.), there is no reason whatsoever why serving 20-100 users should cost $100K. Google had indexed the whole web and was serving most of the Stanford campus before they got their first check for $100K.
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