I'm pretty sure adulthood has always just been a bunch of people pretending that they know what they're doing, and being able to convince everyone else (peers, children) of it as well.
The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
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Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#12This is pompous drivel. Instead of lamenting the reading habits of people that work hard and take care of their families maybe we should try to get everyone with children to be responsible parents. The author mistakes the hard won victories of modern society for some nondescript juvenilism.
>Instead of lamenting the reading habits of people that work hard and take care of their families maybe we should try to get everyone with children to be responsible parents.
I didn't know we had to make a choice.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#13"Noting that nearly a third of Y.A. books were purchased by readers ages 30 to 44 (most of them presumably without teenage children of their own), Graham insisted that such grown-ups “should feel embarrassed about reading literature for children.”" When I was a kid adults read lots of books that were very pulpy, low-brow, "genre" kinds of books - mysteries, westerns, etc. I don't see how Y.A. books are in any way a s…
The main thing to blame for that was WWII, where a lot of people learned to read. When they returned, there was a deluge of inexpensive pulp novels and magazines, in addition to abridged and simplified versions of classic or important works (notably from Reader's Digest.)
Many of the adults consuming these books had just learned to read. I adore that stuff and collect it (for both lurid cover art and lurid content), but the actual gems are not so common and 98% of them are completely unremembered.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#14"Noting that nearly a third of Y.A. books were purchased by readers ages 30 to 44 (most of them presumably without teenage children of their own), Graham insisted that such grown-ups “should feel embarrassed about reading literature for children.”" When I was a kid adults read lots of books that were very pulpy, low-brow, "genre" kinds of books - mysteries, westerns, etc. I don't see how Y.A. books are in any way a s…
What kind of challenges do the characters face? In the YA I remember, characters were struggling to define themselves while figuring out social standing, who their friends were, how to interact with their parents and managing their obligations(typically schoolwork). Those struggles could be abstracted by adding in genre challenges, but were still recognizable, and that was the appeal.
I don't know a ton about pulp genre fiction, but the stuff I read is about people trying to be good at their jobs, take care of their families, meet their obligations, and still end up good and/or alive.
It's still escapist, but I feel more comfortable escaping in to stories where the characters have the same problems I do. I don't judge anyone for reading what they want to, but I don't understand the appeal of reading books about teenagers' problems. and that's fine.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#15This isn't the strongest case for the statement (entirely based on media to represent public will). But let's assume he's right (media is probably a close enough proxy)... What's interesting to think about is that not everyone is failing to become an adult. I'll assert that a big difference between a 'responsible' adult behavior and childish behavior is delaying gratification and getting the outcome you want. If many…
Your speculation presupposes that 'adults' will be more successful than 'non-adults'. It is an interesting experiment, and everyone who is raising kids is participating in it, I think it is too early to guess on which will be the people in control of the knobs next.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#16This is pompous drivel. Instead of lamenting the reading habits of people that work hard and take care of their families maybe we should try to get everyone with children to be responsible parents. The author mistakes the hard won victories of modern society for some nondescript juvenilism.
Not only does it sound like you didn't read the article to the end, it sounds like you didn't even bother to skim past the first 1/3.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#17This isn't the strongest case for the statement (entirely based on media to represent public will). But let's assume he's right (media is probably a close enough proxy)... What's interesting to think about is that not everyone is failing to become an adult. I'll assert that a big difference between a 'responsible' adult behavior and childish behavior is delaying gratification and getting the outcome you want. If many…
For those that to become adults in your scenario, though, the societal markers are stacked heavily against them. Delayed gratification could be something like financial independence, right? How does that square with the heavy push that one should become indebted to others (via credit or loans or what-have-you)?
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#18Arrested development has seemed for quite a while to be a main source of movie humor. "Sideways" comes to mind that way. Considering the way adult male authority appeared in a lot of TV shows (60s and 70s) led me to think that the screenwriters were enacting their own conflict with their bosses, men who made them cut down on risque jokes, nixed plot lines, etc. And those weren't great years for adult male authority i…
In many "teen movies" of the 80s you can feel the scriptwriter working out his/her issues with authority. John Hughes was pretty bad about this, however iconic those movies may have been. I learned to be thankful for movies where teenagers were depicted as whiny, know-nothing, irresponsible kids -- and celebrated for it.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#19I know lots of people who don't want to get legally married, hate that their lives are built around making money, and can't stand the thought of staying in one place for too long. Traditional adulthood is obviously not very appealing to them, and for good reason. We also aren't too keen on abandoning our childhood dreams, hobbies, and aspirations. Some of them want kids, but having kids tends to make living an alternative lifestyle a lot more difficult. I don't know if any of this has anything to do with patriarchy or feminism, but I suppose the people I surround myself with do hold rather egalitarian views.
Re: The Death of Adulthood in American Culture
#20"Noting that nearly a third of Y.A. books were purchased by readers ages 30 to 44 (most of them presumably without teenage children of their own), Graham insisted that such grown-ups “should feel embarrassed about reading literature for children.”" When I was a kid adults read lots of books that were very pulpy, low-brow, "genre" kinds of books - mysteries, westerns, etc. I don't see how Y.A. books are in any way a s…
I agree that it's not necessarily a step backwards in the sense of quality of writing or plot, but I do think the subject matter makes a difference. The detective stories, espionage tales, or even the Harlequin Romance novels were different in that although certainly pulpy and low-brow, the characters were _adults_ facing (moreless) adult situations...not wizards, demons, and dragons.
Why does it really matter if the setting is more-or-less consistent with now or with recent history, vs older history or extrapolated near-future, or speculative advanced technology (sci-fi), or magic aka "sufficiently advanced technology" (fantasy)?
I'd think the part of "subject matter" that would matter, would be what the problems are. Are the characters trying to stay alive, trying to keep their jobs or get promoted, trying to find the best parties to go to, trying to sneak around while avoiding their parent, etc.