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Have a Nice Day

nytimes.com

1–10 of 13 posts

Re: Have a Nice Day

#2
"the utility has to buy the power for a predictable period at a price that is a no-brainer good deal for the family or business putting the solar panels on their rooftop."

Sadly, it is not a no-brainer good deal for the tax payer who ultimately pays for it. It is all well to have the biggest solar power industry, but what if it is all just virtual and breaks down once the subsidies stop?

Re: Have a Nice Day

#3
I don't think the article is about solar panels, not really.

It's how America doesn't produce anything anymore.

The USA is "Consumers 1.0" but 2.0 is taking over elsewhere.

The next leap in solar might not even be invented in the USA, it certainly won't be produced here.

Re: Have a Nice Day

#4
The title is politically loaded. There's something that article is trying to say vis-a-vis government subsidies and free trade, but it never quite materializes, at least I couldn't understand it. But I had no trouble understanding the political outrage it is dripping with.

Re: Have a Nice Day

#5
In October, Applied will be opening the world’s largest solar research center in Xian, China. Gotta go where the customers are.

??? Don't you just have to be where the sun is?

Re: Have a Nice Day

#6
Importing solar panels from China is not even remotely similar to importing oil from the Middle East. If we derived our energy primarily from solar power, we wouldn't need a constant stream of solar panels to keep doing it, the way we need a constant stream of oil now. Also, since the company that makes the machines that makes solar panels, we could easily start producing them for ourselves if China suddenly decided to increase the price the way OPEC has the power to do with oil.

Re: Have a Nice Day

#7
This is just silly. The problem with columnists/pundits who argue for investing in xyz "because we're falling behind" particularly where it relates to immature technologies is that governments have a notoriously bad track record at playing/picking favorites that ultimately win out.

Taking this column specifically, what if it turns out that natural gas is far cheaper and far more abundant than solar - at least in the mid and near term? (after you factor in recent shale gas discoveries, it is). Why not instead develop technologies through companies that enable solar like Applied Materials and in the meantime buy subsidized panels from other countries if that's your cup of tea?

I should note that many of us here are also aware and even aim to replace longstanding competitors who are larger, often better capitalized and are certainly more entrenched with technologies that are cheaper, without the legacy overhead costs and are more agile. Why shouldn't this happen in solar/energy?

In solar in particular, look at thin film solar firms like Nanosolar - http://www.treehugger.com/files/2009/09/nanosolar-solar-powe... - yes, one of their robotic plant may be in Germany, but it is a US developed technology that may end up being far cheaper than traditional solar panels. If anything, American firms have shown when the incentive exists, they can play catch up and they can do it quickly and generally better as US dominance across an array of industries shows (disclosure: I'm a Canadian).

This, incidentally is what can happen when the subsidies go away: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB125193815050081615.html

Re: Have a Nice Day

#8
I don't understand why Friedman would prefer to produce solar panels in America than ship them from China. Trading between nations makes sense for the same reason trading between individuals makes sense: specialization is efficient, leading everyone to greater wealth.

He mentions that China will have a great export platform in renewable energy technology as the world adds 2.5 billion more people. So he's anticipating future demand. It seems to me that that is useful information for entrepreneurs, but it's nothing that demands government action. If entrepreneurs decide it would be profitable to supply that impending demand, then they will. If the government has to subsidize to make that happen, then maybe it shouldn't happen.

Just because there will be future demand for something doesn't mean we need government action to supply it. I'm sure those billions of people will want pants and meat and toothbrushes too, but there's no particular reason why America has to be the place to produce those. Just let people produce whatever they decide is most profitable for them to produce, and we're likely to get a more efficient outcome than one decided by central planning.

I think solar energy is great. If we want it, all we have to do is worry about the demand side, not the supply side. That is, consumers and governments should buy the best, cheapest solar panels available. I don't think it matters where the production, or the R&D, happens.

He suggests that trading solar panels with China might be similar to trading oil with Saudi Arabia. I don't understand why. Trading with Saudi Arabia is considered a problem because the money is thought to fuel terrorism. China doesn't have the nicest foreign policy on the planet, but I'd love to make them more rich, not less, because they seem to be becoming more peaceful as they grow richer. And if China ever starts funding terrorism, it is much easier to set up new solar panel factories than it is to set up new oil fields.

Re: Have a Nice Day

#9

I don't understand why Friedman would prefer to produce solar panels in America than ship them from China. Trading between nations makes sense for the same reason trading between individuals makes sense: specialization is efficient, leading everyone to greater wealth. He mentions that China will have a great export platform in renewable energy technology as the world adds 2.5 billion more people. So he's anticipating…

China doesn't have the nicest foreign policy on the planet

The Chinese policy of non-interference in foreign affairs has shocked people who look at Chinese relationships with N. Korea and Burma. However, I personally feel that Chinese foreign policy is no worse than that of Britain, France or America.

Re: Have a Nice Day

#10
"If we want to launch a solar industry here, big-time, we need to offer the kind of long-term certainty that Germany does..."

The problem here is that there are no long-term certainties in a free-market economy. Providing energy is a competitive business and if solar energy is to grow it has to be a better choice for the consumer economically than the current alternatives at the true unsubsidized cost.

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