GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
31–40 of 83 posts
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#32I can't really take much more of this... What is their goal?
I'm more surprised that NSA didn't already have programs to map the Internet, given how long nmap has been around.
However it has the key words N, S, and A so let's just assume it's something sinister and evil.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
So does it set a precedent that the humble citizen is able to do it without legal ramifications?
In a sense, yes. There will be ramifications, of course, but they are entirely extralegal. It's best not to think of the Five Eyes as being nations of laws.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#34Ironically Jacob Appelbaum, allegedly an investigative journalist who reported this issue, is responsible for this project on GitHub that does exactly the same thing: https://github.com/ioerror/blockfinder
I don't see where blockfinder is actually reaching out and pinging servers to see what's up where. blockfinder seems to be downloading well known data sources as to where IPs are. The project the government is being accused of doing is essentially running a distributed nmap along with geo information.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#35Earlier quoted context omitted.
Governments are either kept honest by a vigilant population of actual citizens (instead of people only interested in their personal affairs ) or are mostly a tool for the rich and powerful to maintain a favorable order. (The only third alternative to a government for the multitudes and a government for the rich is the direct rule of the rich and powerful without or with minimal government, as in the calls for "deregu…
> as in the calls for "deregulation" which seldom favor the average Joe Can you give an example of deregulation that doesn't favor the average Joe? I can't think of one.
Deregulation, throughout history (explore the pre-1930's, pre-GreatDepression US economy), has always left average Joe in a badly disadvantaged state, for the long term.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#36I can't really take much more of this... What is their goal?
At some point a 3 letter agency got a large sum of money and was told "here, gather intelligence". So they did. Hired people, poured money into projects, training, equipment, contractors, promotions. All this wrapped in secrecy and hidden in its own world. Joe Schmo head of department X heading cellphone baseband radio firmware hacks will make sure to lobby for his department and tell everyone how there are all these terrorists everywhere running around discussing dirty bomb plans over cell phone conversation, and only his department can save the world. Does he care about the world? No, but he cares about getting more recognition, more money, a larger budget, more people under him and so on.
Every time something like a terrorist attack, war, defections, leaks happened the tendency is not to evaluate, scale down and reconsider where they are headed. But to ask for more budget, more equipment, more projects. Basically double down.
So it is not that there is a cabal conspiring to hold us down that meets in a dark basement some place. But rather the constraints and rules present, if not actively thought against will lead to this.
Another element in this is that those that might disagree with how things are run, don't get to rise high enough to the top to make a difference. Here we had Binney, Snowden and a few anonymous leakers. But it is not like they could have reason to the top in the administration to make a change from within so to speak. To steer the agency on a Constitutional path. So the top if full of those who believe in doing things the same way they are already being done.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#37Disturbingly, the HACIENDA system actually hijacks civilian computers to do some of its dirty work, allowing it to leach computing resources and cover its tracks. Yeah, that is disturbing, and it should be made illegal.
I think it's already illegal.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
Governments are either kept honest by a vigilant population of actual citizens (instead of people only interested in their personal affairs ) or are mostly a tool for the rich and powerful to maintain a favorable order. (The only third alternative to a government for the multitudes and a government for the rich is the direct rule of the rich and powerful without or with minimal government, as in the calls for "deregu…
> as in the calls for "deregulation" which seldom favor the average Joe Can you give an example of deregulation that doesn't favor the average Joe? I can't think of one.
Deregulation in the sense of stripping very specific regulations designed to prevent exploitation are typically good for the owners of capital and bad for everyone else. Examples include the Depository Institutions Deregulation and Monetary Control Act (Led to Savings & Loan calamity), the Gramm Leach Bliley Act (Led to GFC), California's attempts to deregulate the energy market (Led to Enron and the energy crisis). It's easy to imagine many more scenarios where industries could be deregulated that would cause massive harm to most of society -- virtually all environmental controls fall into this category.
Some of those scenarios could have been prevented if more facets had been deregulated, but they weren't so we lost trillions of dollars in real value and drove debt through the roof.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depository_Institutions_Deregul...
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#39Disturbingly, the HACIENDA system actually hijacks civilian computers to do some of its dirty work, allowing it to leach computing resources and cover its tracks. Yeah, that is disturbing, and it should be made illegal.
I mean, I'm game to make it illegal if it's not already, and it probably already is illegal in the countries where that would be going on.
But when I advocated the viewpoint that unauthorized access to computers was illegal and disturbing back with Aaron Swartz, that viewpoint didn't seem as popular at Hacker News for some reason.
Likewise when Jeremy Hammond admitted to hacking into Stratfor and was duly sentenced, that didn't seem super-popular here.
So if people want strong legal controls (and I do), then great! Let's have those, keeping in mind legal controls apply to everybody, with the state having at least as much authority and power (and often much more) than the public at large.
If people instead believe that the intent and the underlying cause of what you do completely justifies one's actions, then don't be surprised when you see "Bad Guys" doing "Bad Things" because they also deeply believe that what they are doing is right, essential, and good for humanity in general.
Re: GNU hackers discover HACIENDA government surveillance
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think a room full of monkeys wrote this.
For one, it's obviously quite good literature, of the "manifesto" style favored by modernist movements. Second, it makes perfect sense. It describes things seen in strolling around a city (Paris in this case), listing funny street names and shop titles. Plus some references to older art and poetry movements (namely dada and surealism), regarding their promise of a "fuller life" etc. Not sure what it has to do with TF…