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Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

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Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#41

Post by Envec83 »

jason_tko wrote: post #33
Envec83 wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree Michael. That is, in fact, why I said I believe that the business aspect is much less demanding than the development one, at least in the early days of a tech startup. Very interesting topic in my opinion.

Argh - I'm going to give this one more comment and I promise myself I'll stop. The idea that the business aspect is in any way 'much less demanding' is like chalk on the blackboard of my brain. This is not an idea or attitude that will serve you either in life, or in trying to find a great co-founder. You could make the exact opposite argument about the technical aspect, since in startup land there's no point buildin…

I am still not convinced. As Michael pointed out, the first months of a startup will be dedicated to developing the MVP, and then validating it and making the necessary changes to fit it to market. Sure, a business person can help a lot in this process, but the developer will be paramount. So it's 'can help a lot' vs. 'paramount'.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#42

Post by Envec83 »

7Figures2Commas wrote: post #40

> I am already doing fine financially... > And to be clear, I do know how to manage the business aspects too, so it's not like without a business co-founder I would be lost. I'm curious: why are you wasting time worrying about co-founder issues? In your apparent case, a co-founder is a solution to a problem that you don't have. If you're truly capable of financing the launch of a business, developing quality commerci…

Usually other people approach me with their idea, asking if I want to become their co-founder. That is when the fear described above kicks in. And I wouldn't consider taking a shot at the idea alone cause it wouldn't be fair with the other person.

That being said I also think that I could benefit from having the right co-founder. I am doing fine financially, but I am still looking to hit a homerun and never need to worry about money again, and to reach this kind of success most people would agree that having a co-founder increases your chances a lot.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#43

Post by nathan-wailes »

fellars wrote: post #14

Ive been investigating the grunt fund [0] concept lately and plan to use it with my current startup to bring on a partner. I think it would go along way to ease your concerns. [0] Http://slicingpie.com

Not sure why this got downvoted, I didn't know about this book / site and just spent an hour watching a talk he gave at Stanford (he posted it on his site). I see some problems with his method but it looks like a step in the right direction.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#44

Post by michaelq »

jason_tko wrote: post #31
michaelq wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rather than dismissing my cofounder as terrible, I encourage you to consider the possibility that advice like yours, which we followed in cofounding the company, set him up for failure. Having specialization early on was a mistake. It was a difficult situation, and it wasn't entirely his fault that there was, for long stretches of time, little for him to do. A startup cycle goes something like this: initial theory ->…

It seems as though you're coming at this with a very different world view and set of experiences than me, which is fine. Maybe we can learn something from each other. To give two sentences of background, I've been running businesses for 13 years, and running a startup for 4 years. The first business I built by myself from nothing, and the second I built alongside my technical co-founder. Firstly I'm concerned that yo…

How did you build the product that your first business sold without a technical person onboard? You coded it yourself. Thus, you have technical skills.

9 years later, when you were looking for a cofounder, you decided to go with a technical cofounder.

You can talk all you want, but at the end of the day, you chose to bring on a second technical cofounder (the first being yourself) over the business cofounder that you are recommending the OP seek out.

N.b. by technical cofounder, I don't necessarily mean someone with a PhD in Computer Vision. I mean someone who can productively write API integrations and use whatever tools are needed (e.g. Rails, Meteor, Xcode) to build the product.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#45

Post by Envec83 »

Duhck wrote: post #39

As a technical CEO without cofounders, perhaps I can help shed some light on this topic. (I didn't take on a cofounder for these very reasons) 1) You need to trust your cofounder(s) entirely. If you don't have trust, you will have fear, and that will lead to resentment and ultimately a breakdown of the relationship. Doing work as a technical resource looks very different from doing work as a business resource. Techni…

Thanks for the feedback.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#46

Post by Envec83 »

Iftheshoefits wrote: post #6

Here's a specific answer to number 2, because it's trivial: structure your business founding contracts and documents accordingly. Make sure there are clauses for vesting or share distribution that reflect what you'd find acceptable with respect to effort delivered. These documents can be as detailed and fine-grained as you like, down to the minute if you're especially motivated/masochistic. For the first question, I…

Thanks for the feedback man. I agree with most points, including with the fact that it might be an ego problem to begin with!

I'll give this some more thought.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#47

Post by johngalt »

Perspective is in the wrong place. Don't think in terms of relative value: 'I'm doing 80% of the work and getting 50% of the benefit'. Instead think of the absolute value of a co-founder: 'Solo I might be able to make an acquihire for a good signing bonus, but as a team we have a shot at eight figures'. Half of 10mil is better than all of 100k. If the co-founder doesn't increase the expected value of the company, then you're correct to pull the plug

Secondly you have a narrow criteria. It's extremely difficult to find people who can continuously work at a high volume. Consistent 60-80 weeks just aren't in the realm of most people. It's not incorrect to want this, or to search for it, just don't expect to find it regularly. Even when you do find someone like that, you may not realize it. Visibility can be a huge impediment. You'll directly see 100% of the things you work on and accomplish. Maybe 10-15% of what your co-founder works on.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#49

Post by Envec83 »

johngalt wrote: post #47

Perspective is in the wrong place. Don't think in terms of relative value: 'I'm doing 80% of the work and getting 50% of the benefit'. Instead think of the absolute value of a co-founder: 'Solo I might be able to make an acquihire for a good signing bonus, but as a team we have a shot at eight figures'. Half of 10mil is better than all of 100k. If the co-founder doesn't increase the expected value of the company, the…

Very good points, especially about the visibility aspect.

And I agree, it's better to have half of a big pie than 100% of a small pie.

Thanks.

Re: Ask HN: How to overcome the fear of doing more than your co-founder?

#50

Post by Envec83 »

cynusx wrote: post #26

Use reverse vesting and don't put provisions in that cofounders can't fire each other. This will twist the incentives to align everybody. 1. if you do 80% of the work and he does 20%, you can fire him and reap 100% of the rewards 2. Same holds for you so it is fair 3. The person who works the hardest will be the hardest to fire so if there is a big conflict the guy who doesn't work as hard will go. In case of conflic…

I agree, vesting might help a lost with the practical side of things. Thanks.
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