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Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

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Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#81

Post by sbierwagen »

dkirtley wrote: post #74
scythe wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>D-He3 fusion produces less neutron flux than D-T, but it's hardly aneutronic-- otherwise they couldn't breed 3He from it. You can't "breed" 3He; you have to breed tritium, which decays to He3 with a half-life of 12 years. D-3He reactors do produce some neutrons, roughly 1% of the flux of D-T, and almost entirely from D-D side-reactions. Actually, a big problem with D-3He as of today is the lack of neutrons -- since…

Great reply. The wiki also has a long discussion about Helium 3. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helium-3 Fusion produces neutrons either in the first or secondary reactions, but there are ways to minimize the amount of them and their energy (and damage/radioactivity)to where you don't generate "nuclear waste". There is an interesting continuum of fusion reactions from pure D-D (which produces little energy, but lots of…

He3 is never added? How long can a reactor run without supplying He3?

(This thread is having a hard time settling on a single isotope notation.)

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#82

Post by Arnor »

sillysaurus3 wrote: post #59
ChuckMcM wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The risk of #3 is that they don't create fusion but they do develop a machine that can emit streams of hot plasma which is then turned into the Navy's weapon of choice for close weapons support on carrier battle groups. That said, I am looking forward to at least one of the fusion efforts bearing fruit. I'm something of an optimist here but I expect a durable solution to the 'energy problem' to emerge from our develo…

The risk of #3 is that they don't create fusion but they do develop a machine that can emit streams of hot plasma which is then turned into the Navy's weapon of choice for close weapons support on carrier battle groups. Why is that a risk? I'd like to live in a country with that technology, because otherwise other countries will have it and we won't.

It's a risk to the investment firms because it would deplete an upside they get from this investment: the halo effect.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#83

Post by rsync »

philwelch wrote: post #79
ChuckMcM wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The risk of #3 is that they don't create fusion but they do develop a machine that can emit streams of hot plasma which is then turned into the Navy's weapon of choice for close weapons support on carrier battle groups. That said, I am looking forward to at least one of the fusion efforts bearing fruit. I'm something of an optimist here but I expect a durable solution to the 'energy problem' to emerge from our develo…

> The risk of #3 is that they don't create fusion but they do develop a machine that can emit streams of hot plasma which is then turned into the Navy's weapon of choice for close weapons support on carrier battle groups. The possibility of pivoting your business model to "building plasma cannons for the Navy" is less of a risk and more of an awesome opportunity. I mean, defense contracting is a bit of a drag and the…

"I mean, defense contracting is a bit of a drag and there's tons of red tape"

Not to mention the tremendous moral hazard. I am unclear as to how anyone can function as a reasonable moral actor when they profit from war.

Calling it "defense" does not solve that problem.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#84

Post by ghshephard »

marcell wrote: post #60

Can someone explain why this team is confident that they can build a commercially viable reactor in 3 years? Conventional wisdom is that nuclear fusion is "decades away". What does this team know that others don't?

The type of Nuclear Fusion they are talking about is quite different than what ITER is working on. It's on a much smaller scale - around 50 MW, which is on the scale of a large diesel generator. The cost is also not that ground breaking - around $0.04/kWh, which is around where Natural Gas and Coal plants are.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#85

Post by ghshephard »

soperj wrote: post #78
malandrew wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why this was downvoted. I'm not going to discount the possibility to invent something worse then our most powerful fusion bomb, but if we talk probability here, developing processes that allow greater control is likely to result in a worst case scenario where we have a weapon that is at most as powerful as what we already have, but more focused. IMHO focused fusion destruction is likely to be far m…

I'll never understand being able to kill someone in a humane way(through acts of war). You're killing someone.

It's like humane slaughter of animals for food - there are ways that don't cause unnecessary pain, others that do.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#86

Post by kumarski »

The reasons Nuclear Fusion presents a difficult problem:

1.) There's no chain reaction mechanism. 2.) The probability of a reaction constrains reaction size. 3.) The absurd amount of heat generated by fusion. I think I once heard it was 100M degrees.

Curious, anybody know how they design around this? Are they using some form of magnetized containment?

Excited to see this funded.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#87

Post by baq »

venomsnake wrote: post #15
mjhouse wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

especially for a product that is just hoping to break even on power generation.

They break even and are billionaires. They manage to create 2+ EROEI and we are talking trillions.

or dead; possibly both (i dearly hope not for both cases!). a working fusion reactor with advertised properties will disrupt the current political balance of power on the planet. intelligence agencies of certain fossil fuel-driven countries might get orders to not let the situation go that far. hopefully certain other intelligence agencies will be able to protect the effort.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#88

Post by jccooper »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #39
rdl wrote: post #23

It's interesting that you can justify this investment in at least four separate ways, independently: 1) Even if there is a low chance of success, it would be wildly profitable if successful, and investing early gets you a good share if it's successful. 2) Fusion power would make the world a better place; investing in this way, when you already have huge returns and it's someone else's money, is actually rational even…

The risk of #3 is that they don't create fusion but they do develop a machine that can emit streams of hot plasma which is then turned into the Navy's weapon of choice for close weapons support on carrier battle groups. That said, I am looking forward to at least one of the fusion efforts bearing fruit. I'm something of an optimist here but I expect a durable solution to the 'energy problem' to emerge from our develo…

No doubt they could come up with something dangerous, but I wouldn't worry about that particular mode. Plasma doesn't travel far.

A nice portable high intensity directed neutron radiation source might be pretty nasty, though.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#89

Post by BugBrother »

soperj wrote: post #78
malandrew wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why this was downvoted. I'm not going to discount the possibility to invent something worse then our most powerful fusion bomb, but if we talk probability here, developing processes that allow greater control is likely to result in a worst case scenario where we have a weapon that is at most as powerful as what we already have, but more focused. IMHO focused fusion destruction is likely to be far m…

I'll never understand being able to kill someone in a humane way(through acts of war). You're killing someone.

How about if we put it like this?

When a democracy has a war with a dictatorship it is similar to when the police defends civilians from violence.

(So this don't get into a shouting match: Check "democratic peace theory". I am aware of that the police can misuse their position. A democracy often also do cynical realpolitik when it isn't its voters that gets harmed.)

Edit: You might want to do the distinction of a junta that do a general draft, so there are soldiers for the dictator which didn't volunteer. It isn't an easy solution, but citizens in a country can theoretically overthrow their dictator. Hopefully with more help than the Syrians got from Obama.

Edit 2: I assume that you don't think it is immoral to sell weapons to police. If you are that pacifist, then I think you should move to some place without police to protect you... I hear they have good weather in inner Somalia and southern Yemen. Both are traditional clan societies without police.

Edit 3: Ah, you have a 60s style of police racial violence discussion in the USA right now. I get the down votes.

Re: Y Combinator And Mithril Invest In Helion, A Nuclear Fusion Startup

#90

Post by jschulenklopper »

aetherson wrote: post #17

> Helion CEO David Kirtley says that his company can do it in three. Three... years? Decades? Days? Millennia?

Well, there is a kind-of-joke that commercially-available fusion energy is perpetually described as "30 years away". It always appears to be stuck at least a generation away... hopefully someone finds a breakthrough.

To put this in context, even the international ITER project is 'experimental' (with a budget of € 15 billion, expected to be switched on in 2019), and is expected to be followed up with a demonstration plant in 2040...

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