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Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

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Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#71

Post by purephase »

ch4s3 wrote: post #25

"Programs like this had existed for decades, but MonsterMind software would add a unique new capability: Instead of simply detecting and killing the malware at the point of entry, MonsterMind would automatically fire back, with no human involvement. That's a problem, Snowden says, because the initial attacks are often routed through computers in innocent third countries. “These attacks can be spoofed,” he says. “You…

It's fucking crazy. It means that the US could instigate either a "cyber-war" or a real war between two separate nations with no one being the wiser.

Truly terrifying, and probably the largest revelation in the article. This is was the major news outlets should be covering, right now.

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#72

Post by TuringTest »

toyg wrote: post #37
Hacker37 wrote: post #14

I am not sure what part of the story was not already told.

TAO bricking the Syrian main router and MonsterMind implementing a sort of cyber-MAD system, are explicitly called out as exclusive revelations. They are important because: * Until now, any loss of Internet connectivity in Syria has always been interpreted as "bad dictator censoring people". I'm not saying that's never been the case, but now we know the US can have more control on global internet infrastructure than…

> I'm not saying that's never been the case, but now we know the US can have more control on global internet infrastructure than we knew possible.

About ten years ago we learned that a teacher at my faculty (maths and CS), a world class specialist in graphs theory and finding critical nodes at small world networks, was contacted by a US three letter agency. I've assumed since then that the US government could shut down the internet any time if they really, really wanted to do it.

I didn't consider that they would shut down whole countries as a result of bricking routers from unintended hacking errors, though. Reality keeps outdoing the wildest figments of imagination.

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#73

Post by drez »

chatmasta wrote: post #68
belorn wrote: post #47

A division of NSA hackers attempted in 2012 to remotely install an exploit in one of the core routers at a major Internet service provider in Syria, which was in the midst of a prolonged civil war. But something went wrong, and the router was bricked instead, which caused Syria to suddenly lose all connection to the Internet. So in middle of a war zone, US conducted sabotage to core infrastructure of an other nation,…

> In middle of a war zone > In peacetime So which is it? There was (is) a war raging in Syria, the US has interests there -- like it or not -- and the NSA is a US intelligence agency. This story sounds like an example of the NSA just doing its job. I have no problem with the NSA spying on foreign communications or disrupting them. After all, that's their job. What else would we use the NSA for? What I do have a probl…

> I have no problem with the NSA spying on foreign communications or disrupting them. After all, that's their job. What else would we use the NSA for?

Really? You don't have an issue with a foreign intelligence agency disrupting core infrastructure for a nation in the midst of a civil war? Especially against a nation we are not even at war with?

What if the Chinese (or anyone else) did something similar? Would that not be considered an outright act of war?

We are not at war with Syria, we should not be disrupting anything. There could have easily have been numerous deaths directly resulting from that outage.

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#76

Post by differentView »

nabla9 wrote: post #49
toyg wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would say that for every whistle blower there is two spies who spy for Russia or China That's an exaggeration, IMHO. This is not the Cold War, where many actors were moved by ideological considerations that crossed national borders (like the Cambridge Five, for example). Nowadays, national and cultural lines are extremely well drawn, so motivations for "traitors" boil down to money and/or blackmail, which are usu…

I think records speak against your IMHO. 1. Ideology has not been the major modus operandi in long time (since 50's). Nowadays idealogical reasons are replaced by cultural and ethnic loyalties. Wast majority of people who spied for China have had Chinese heritage. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chinese_intelligence_operation... 2. Money and personal problems/reasons seems to be major reason for spying against US and f…

>Wast majority of people who spied for China have had Chinese heritage.

Though I also believe this to be true, what we know for sure are that most of the people CAUGHT spying for China had Chinese heritage.

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#77

Post by TuringTest »

chatmasta wrote: post #68
belorn wrote: post #47

A division of NSA hackers attempted in 2012 to remotely install an exploit in one of the core routers at a major Internet service provider in Syria, which was in the midst of a prolonged civil war. But something went wrong, and the router was bricked instead, which caused Syria to suddenly lose all connection to the Internet. So in middle of a war zone, US conducted sabotage to core infrastructure of an other nation,…

> In middle of a war zone > In peacetime So which is it? There was (is) a war raging in Syria, the US has interests there -- like it or not -- and the NSA is a US intelligence agency. This story sounds like an example of the NSA just doing its job. I have no problem with the NSA spying on foreign communications or disrupting them. After all, that's their job. What else would we use the NSA for? What I do have a probl…

The US didn't declare war on Syria.

> I have no problem with the NSA spying on foreign communications or disrupting them.

Should the rest of countries just assume that the US is a permanent military enemy? You don't seem to have a problem with treating them as such.

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#78

Post by peterwwillis »

Can someone remind me why Snowden became a public figure in the first place? The second leaker is anonymous and practically invisible, and here Snowden is, constantly getting more press. It's like he wants to be as visible as possible while other leakers want the opposite.

Edit: Can somebody tell me what was downvote-worthy about this comment? This is getting ridiculous.

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#79

Post by slg »

adityab wrote: post #18

Two key 'new' things from this article, that were previously unknown: 1. The NSA exploited the firmware of a Syrian core internet router, and bricked it by mistake. This was an "oh shit" moment (sic). So in it's eagerness to scoop up all digital communications, it killed the majormost way for citizens to communicate while in the midst of a civil war. Great. 2. There is a project called "MonsterMind", which 100% autom…

It is in revealing things like this that make me question Snowden. While both points are interesting and maybe a little troubling, they are certainly not whistleblowing in the name of protecting the rights of American citizens. He has moved from simply exposing the breadth of the domestic spying apparatus to exposing the tactics the United States uses in legitimate espionage operations. Isn't trying to compromise the communication network of a country like Syria the exact thing the NSA is supposed to be doing? And what positive value comes from Snowden releasing something like that?

Re: Edward Snowden: The Untold Story

#80

Post by tptacek »

drez wrote: post #73
chatmasta wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> In middle of a war zone > In peacetime So which is it? There was (is) a war raging in Syria, the US has interests there -- like it or not -- and the NSA is a US intelligence agency. This story sounds like an example of the NSA just doing its job. I have no problem with the NSA spying on foreign communications or disrupting them. After all, that's their job. What else would we use the NSA for? What I do have a probl…

> I have no problem with the NSA spying on foreign communications or disrupting them. After all, that's their job. What else would we use the NSA for? Really? You don't have an issue with a foreign intelligence agency disrupting core infrastructure for a nation in the midst of a civil war? Especially against a nation we are not even at war with? What if the Chinese (or anyone else) did something similar? Would that n…

Do you really believe that France, China, and Israel haven't owned up US routers? Should we declare war on them?
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