Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America • Hacker News Board

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#311

Post by Ecio78 » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 1:12 PM UTC

hrbrtglm wrote: post #25

I love the metric system for no better reasons that it's the one I always used as a french, it just seems as natural for me as my ten fingers, I never really thought about it. Yet, I can understand why some would not change their “English customary measures”, they must feel it the same way, thinking it's as natural as their feet. For instance, our screens size (TV, computer, phones) are expressed in inches for whatev…

I completely agree with you (even though you're French and I'm Italian ;)). I am used to metric system, but for some thing it's normal to use other measure we are used to. The example is exactly the one you're making, screen size for me it's normal to think about it in inches because it was always like this, and when sometimes I see TV screen sizes expressed in centimeters here in Luxembourg/Germany, I have to look for the conversion (or guess it sometimes from the model name) because I was thinking "42 is not enough, 50 is ok, 55 could be the right size for me, 60 is probably too much).

At the end it's mainly a matter of being used to, and being afraid of changing too

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#312

Post by underwater » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 1:51 PM UTC

wtbob wrote: post #297

shmerl wrote: post #259

> Customary measures make a lot more sense to us. Did they make any less sense in UK where they originated? Yet UK pushed through with switching to metric and went way further than US did. So this excuse isn't really valid. The real answer is, that in US politicians were too weak to push this through, because all kind of manufacturers and unions were pressuring them to stop the effort. In UK they just ignored the pre…

> The real answer is, that in US politicians were too weak to push this through, because all kind of manufacturers and unions were pressuring them to stop the effort. No, the real answer is that US politicians were too weak to push this through, because the people wouldn't have it. The people spoke.

The people optimitized for the short term (not having to learn a new system) over long term benefit (a simpler system).

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#313

Post by ivanhoe » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:15 PM UTC

ajuc wrote: post #293

bowlofpetunias wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, "soccer fields" is a very common way to reference size/length in various European cultures.

Which ones? I've never heard it.

also in Eastern Europe...

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#314

Post by tsotha » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:23 PM UTC

shmerl wrote: post #259

> Customary measures make a lot more sense to us. Did they make any less sense in UK where they originated? Yet UK pushed through with switching to metric and went way further than US did. So this excuse isn't really valid. The real answer is, that in US politicians were too weak to push this through, because all kind of manufacturers and unions were pressuring them to stop the effort. In UK they just ignored the pre…

>Yet UK pushed through with switching to metric and went way further than US did. So this excuse isn't really valid.

And yet they didn't switch over completely. People in the UK measure some things in metric and some things in the old Imperial units, which is the worst of both worlds. Pick up some random thing and its weight is measured in kg, but if you're weighing a person it's "stones". From here to the wall may be about two meters, but from here to London is 100 miles. I'd rather have what we have in the US, thanks all the same.

>The real answer is, that in US politicians were too weak to push this through, because all kind of manufacturers and unions were pressuring them to stop the effort. In UK they just ignored the pressure. In US they budged.

Politicians aren't supposed to be "strong". They're supposed to do what the voters want them to do. If politicians are forcing you to do something you don't want to do, your government is out of control. In the US the people didn't want to convert to metric because it's easier to estimate in whatever system you grew up with. Manufacturers were all for the metric system since it makes managing global supply chains easier.

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#315

Post by ivanhoe » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:39 PM UTC

Author wrongly presumes that people using the metric system are not visualizing the measures in almost the same way. We do. One step is about a meter, or the width of finger is about 1 cm. More often used 10 centimeters (1 decimeter) is approx. a distance from your thumb to the index finger. It's all about being used to certain system of measures, so that you can automatically relate the measure to something from the real life for comparison, e.g. my car is 5m long, also the wall in my room is around 5m, so if you ask me how big is 5m I can instantly visualize the distance very accurately (without even consciously thinking about cars or walls)

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#316

Post by JoeAltmaier » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:42 PM UTC

ivanhoe wrote: post #315

Author wrongly presumes that people using the metric system are not visualizing the measures in almost the same way. We do. One step is about a meter, or the width of finger is about 1 cm. More often used 10 centimeters (1 decimeter) is approx. a distance from your thumb to the index finger. It's all about being used to certain system of measures, so that you can automatically relate the measure to something from the…

Whereas my foot is ... a foot. My pace is a yard. My thumb is about an inch. Works both ways.

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#317

Post by lotsofmangos » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:46 PM UTC

NickNameNick wrote: post #304

bronson wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nah, I just couldn't picture anyone doing woodwork in hundreds or thousands of units (now, where did I get that idea...?), or dividing base 10 units. Since it sounds like wood is sold and worked in base 12, I'd use metric no problem. But that makes the difference between imperial and metric pretty arbitrary, doesn't it?

I've actually worked in the construction industry in New Zealand, which was thoroughly metric when I was building houses ~10 years ago. And we did everything in mm, standardised timber was "100x50" - mm was assumed, which was close to 2x4 Inches. (Actually, I think the finished standardised timber is smaller than 100mmx50mm, but for some reason was still called 100x50) sheets of Gib plaster (Drywall?) were 1200x3600,…

Dressmakers have it really bad in the UK, as when you buy fabric, the widths are in inches and length is in meters.

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#318

Post by ivanhoe » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:47 PM UTC

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #316

ivanhoe wrote: post #315

Author wrongly presumes that people using the metric system are not visualizing the measures in almost the same way. We do. One step is about a meter, or the width of finger is about 1 cm. More often used 10 centimeters (1 decimeter) is approx. a distance from your thumb to the index finger. It's all about being used to certain system of measures, so that you can automatically relate the measure to something from the…

Whereas my foot is ... a foot. My pace is a yard. My thumb is about an inch. Works both ways.

absolutely... problem is that I have to think hard to figure out how much a yard is, and you have the same problem with meters. That's what standards are for.

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#319

Post by Tloewald » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:54 PM UTC

The beauty of the old system was that it mapped onto the everyday experience of farmers. I am sure hundredweights and furlongs and so forth all made lots of sense. But units have to cross cultures and times — the only intuitive units left to boast about are the foot and the yard, which are 30cm and roughly a meter. Indeed, we are probably taller now than when the yard was defined to the extent that the meter is probably closer to an intuitive yard than the yard is.

Incidentally, the official definition of an inch is 2.54cm. Now that's intuitive.

Re: Death by Inches: The battle over the metric system in America

#320

Post by stephen_g » Sun, Aug 10, 2014, 2:54 PM UTC

ajuc wrote: post #291

Centimeter is about 2 grids in a school "checked" notebook. Everybody know after using these notebooks fot the whole education how long exactly that is. No problems with eyeballing. I have problems eyeballing an inch (only used in 5.25 or 3.14 disk sizes and in monitors' sizes). Milimeter is close to smallest unit useful in human scale - when you try to draw 0.5 milimeter scale with a regular pen, for example, the li…

> Food stuff is bought in "dekos" (dekagrams).

Where? I've lived my whole life in a metric-using country and I'm fairly sure I have literally never heard of that unit until just now...

Our food here is all in grams (i.e. a 100g packet of chips, 300g steak) or kilograms (1.5 kilo bag of rice).