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Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

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Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#41
There's not really a good correlation between price and "goodness" of wine. The real rule of wine is, if you like it, it's good wine. If you don't like how it tastes, it's not good wine. That's it.

The wine world is notoriously pretentious.

It's good to know locations, varietals and aging a little because it can help you narrow the window down to find a wine you'll probably like well enough vs ones you won't. I for example, tend not to like Malbecs. Why? I dunno, just something in the flavor. I also don't like Mountain Dew.

Wine can help accent or suppress flavors in your food as well. Just like drinking beer with pizza tastes good, you probably wouldn't drink coke with your morning cereal.

If you really want to get into wines, there seems to be a correlation between rating and flavor complexity. And there's all kinds of ways to taste (or miss) complexity in wines. Just like a good bbq sauce has elements of sweet, sour, spicy, etc., wine can be more or less complex in flavors. But not everybody likes complex flavors and that's fine. That's easier in fact since complexity is usually a result of more expensive wine making processes like aging so your local Two-Buck Chuck might make those people happy. But detecting the differences or preferences for flavor complexity is like detecting the differences between two different batches of your grandmother's home-made Spaghetti sauce. You can probably describe it (the first had more garlic, the second more basil), but absolute comparisons are really impossible and don't really matter all that much. It's like asking "which is better a sponge or the number 7?"

Something revealed to me during trips to various places where a glass of wine with lunch or dinner is normal, is that wine is just another drink. Some of the better meals I've had were had with a 2 euro 1/2 L carafe of the local watered down table wine. In these places, wine is just a drink, like juice, water or soda. People who drink wine with every meal really don't care what the wine is so long as it doesn't taste bad.

You can probably find more than enough wines anybody will like for under $10 a bottle.

It's just a drink.

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#42

Blah blah blah, drink your wine and enjoy it. If you like it great. This doesn't mean all aspects are purely taste, like: acidity, tanninity, type of grape, etc

having come to that realization myself, that's more or less what i tell people who are new to wine. but i added something: learn how to describe what you like (or don't like) so that you can find new wines to try and are likely to enjoy. figure out how to communicate, say, a certain flavor with the term "tannin" or "oak" and when you talk with a wine expert you can learn new varietals to try. since i've done this (in…

Yeah exactly, all the varietals and vintage and flavor descriptions are basically just ways of narrowing the window to help you find something you might like.

For example, I tend to like wines with medium tannins and oak flavor, deep plum and tobacco notes. If there's spice flavors or not I'm also fine. I find I usually can find what I want in Chilean Cabs, and have less luck with other wines.

However, I've liked other kinds of wines too. Where I live the local Cabs are generally terrible, but the local Chambourcins, which have few of the qualities I generally look for, are good drinks too.

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#43

I have wanted to perform a rigorous double-blind wine-tasting experiment for a long time, but have always lacked the resources. The true test of the validity of wine-tasting isn't whether experts can tell "good" wine from "bad" wine, but whether experts can reliably describe the same wine with the same language with an acceptably small margin of error. My ideal experiment would give blindfolded wine experts a number…

One cheap test I like to do when with friends is to order a flight of something, have each person taste it in turns, then have one person shuffle the glasses around while the others aren't watching, recording how they were shuffled (if you want everyone to participate, just have a second person do a second shuffle).

It's then everybody's job to taste again and see if they can put the glasses back in order. So far, nobody I've done this with has performed better than chance with vodka tastings and people barely perform better than chance with red wine tastings, even when they're 3 different varietals.

The test tends to come out after at least a few drinks though so most people's palates are at least somewhat compromised.

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#44
post #37
post #6

I'll just throw this whisky tasting link in for contrast: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Boj33DVSILQ

For contrast here's another I've always enjoyed, a little more playful: http://youtu.be/BW1te_miu5I

I like Paterson, but I always appreciated Charles MacLean's more relaxed delivery -- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLC6CEFB7B0C73A51D

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#46

A few weeks ago I was cooking dinner for a couple of couples at our house. I opened a fancy bottle of wine about an hour ahead of time, and I also had an $8 bottle left over from cooking breakfast the day before. (You'd think from all this that I'm some kind of chef, but it doesn't take much to throw a little wine on some mushrooms.) I had a couple of sleeves for wine bottles, so I decided to put them over the bottle…

In college we used to pour handles of McCormick vodka into left over Grey Goose bottles(same ones used over and over). I think you all can guess that no one ever knew the difference. :p

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#47
post #27

So is this article saying that trying to quantify what makes a wine "good" or "bad" is a matter of perspective and lacks any kind scientific method? I mean, do we need a scientific method if it is something we collectively can pretty much agree upon? They can do all the studies they want and criticize this all to the finest minutiae, but in my own personal experience I can say with certainty that wine recommended me…

No, it's saying that people who claim to be able to identify which wines are "better" than others (and how they differ) can't reliably do that.

Wine recommended to you by trusted experts is not better than just blindly picking a bottle. Or at least, that is not something you can "say with certainty" if you haven't tested it. (And if you do test it, the results are likely to surprise you.) An awful lot of the experience of wine turns out to be the result of your expectations of it.

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#48
For your average Joe, yet is probably is (it certainly is for myself), but those who are 'trained' in the field or have had experience will be able to taste subtle differences between a £10 bottle of wine from Bordeaux and a £10 bottle of wine from Cali.

Re: Is Wine-Tasting Junk Science?

#49
post #44
post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For contrast here's another I've always enjoyed, a little more playful: http://youtu.be/BW1te_miu5I

I like Paterson, but I always appreciated Charles MacLean's more relaxed delivery -- https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLC6CEFB7B0C73A51D

Thanks, this guy's voice is super soothing.
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