Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online • Hacker News Board

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#211

Post by blisterpeanuts » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:02 PM UTC

personZ wrote: post #191

67726e wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I walked into a restaurant and the owner threatened to kick my ass if I posted a bad Yelp review and I decided to leave without eating, would I be qualified to write a review about their practices? I didn't eat at the restaurant. There was no business exchange. I'm reviewing the business' policies and warning others of something I find distasteful. In your example, what if I read the online menu and found some fin…

None of these people walked into the business. I doubt any of them are planning a wedding reception, if even in the target geographic market. This is a standard internet lynch mob. They are always vile, reprehensible things, with real humans as victim. But pile on, everyone.

Well, browsing to a hotel's website, prepared to purchase a reservation is virtually the same as walking into a business, is it not? People don't physically go to a hotel to reserve a room, so the hotel's website could be considered a place of business, practically speaking.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#212

Post by aestra » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:02 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #205

aestra wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>when people tell me what a great experience they had with the staff and that the owner came to their table and chatted with them This tends to be a part of a broad cultural expectation. Americans tend to equate "good service" with [fake] niceness and obligated smiles and cheeriness. Some other cultures are different where good service means simply doing your job. I can't count how many times people have gone to othe…

> Now when I go to Walgreens they say to me after any transaction "be well." Seriously? Like I believe the cashier ringing up my candy and soda purchase personally cares about my well being and health? Or that it is adding anything of value to the transaction? Its a corporate slogan with tie-ins to Walgreen's marketing and branding. Like most aspects of branding, its not designed to operate at the level of rational t…

Doesn't make it less obnoxious. (to me)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Have_a_nice_day#.22Have_a_Nice_...

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#213

Post by hawkharris » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:06 PM UTC

danielweber wrote: post #71

hawkharris wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You misinterpreted my comment. Yes, it would be unacceptable to lie and say that we've all visited the hotel, but that's not what I'm advocating. I specifically said "based on the revelation that none of the other reviews are trustworthy." This isn't simply based on an article I've read. It's a public policy posted by the hotel. I'm suggesting that people comment on a public policy. No more, no less.

Your words: "Our immediate response should be to post negative reviews based on the revelation that none of the other reviews are trustworthy." You don't know anything about the quality of their online reviews. No, I mean it, you really don't: 5 minutes wasn't enough time for you to investigate this policy and see how long it's been in place. Perhaps this policy is brand new and hasn't affected any online reviews yet…

You're regurgitating a common narrative about online witch hunts. While I agree that they're unethical, that's clearly not what's happening here. The comments that have superseded yours in this thread echo that sentiment. The other commenters and I agree that if an organization creates a public policy, people should be able to criticize the group on the basis of that policy. It's as simple as that.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#214

Post by aestra » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:07 PM UTC

untog wrote: post #176

chasing wrote: post #84

Yes. And because of this you should definitely go to Yelp and give them a one-star review. And destroy their Facebook page. And maybe go take a shit on their doorstep. That's definitely the answer when a small business makes an error like this. They're frustrated by something they don't feel is fair and made a ham-fisted attempt to fix the problem. Ruin them. (The ice machine thing, though -- that actually seems like…

"An error" suggests a lack of intent - a mistake, if you will. This isn't a mistake. It's a blatant attempt at gaming a review system.

"An error" can also mean an error in judgement or an error in business.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#215

Post by DanBC » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

aestra wrote: post #206

peroo wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As bad as the star system is, I'm not sure there's anything better. I think Amazon has the right idea with the "Was this review helpful to you?" buttons, though that may not work quite as well for Yelp if you consider the possibility of review-burying by owners.

>I think Amazon has the right idea with the "Was this review helpful to you?" buttons Doubtful. "Was this review helpful to you?" is actually the "I disagree with this review" button in practice. Amazon reviews are so crappy. There is tons of reviews that say JUST "I haven't used this product/read this book yet." plus any number of stars.

> Amazon reviews are so crappy. There is tons of reviews that say JUST "I haven't used this product/read this book yet." plus any number of stars.

While it's extra work I love those reviews.

"I haven't read this book but $THING IS WRONG, thus one " mean I can ignore some of the low ratings.

While reviews and ratings are weird and probably need some tweaking at some point[1] they are not nearly as bad as the weirdly broken search. I've got to the point where I would pay money to have better Amazon (also ebay) search*.[2]

[1]along the lines suggested in this thread - I might dislike a movie but love the genre; I might love a movie but generally dislike that genre; etc. So some method of saying why you like something so much would perhaps be handy.

[2] I go to Amazon.co.uk and I search for [microwave oven]. I chose a department - kitchen & home. I then sort by price, low to high. I am flooded with totally irrelevant items. (Egg cup; aluminum foil; salt&pepper shakers; children's cutlery sets; etc). You're not supposed to use search to find microwave ovens, you're supposed to drill down the tree of department, items, specific items.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#216

Post by personZ » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:13 PM UTC

67726e wrote: post #208

personZ wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None of these people walked into the business. I doubt any of them are planning a wedding reception, if even in the target geographic market. This is a standard internet lynch mob. They are always vile, reprehensible things, with real humans as victim. But pile on, everyone.

And my point went entirely over your head. If someone finds the business policies reprehensible and wants it to be made known, they have a damned right to let it be known. One doesn't just have to purchase a product or service to be allowed to comment.

No, it didn't "go over my head", though if that notion gives you more comfort, have at it. You brought up an absurd anecdote that is baseless and has zero applicability to this issue, but that you think props up your notion. Don't bring up absurd anecdotes if you don't want them deconstructed.

Let me say again, and this relates to the sibling comment to yours -- none of these people piling on the internet circle jerk torch mob had any interest or engagement with this business. They weren't en route to book their wedding party when they discovered this. They're just trying to feel good by joining a misled, destructive, abusive mob.

It is bullies, pure and simple. Some restaurant I have zero concern about put up a misled threat, in a plain and obvious location, to try to make sure that wedding parties didn't mislead their guests, so now we all must rail about "free speech" and attack someone's business. The employers of people.

Yeah, I'm perhaps a little too mature to see that as constructive for anyone. It is vile.

This has happened so many times before. And after there is the realization that it was all profoundly silly and destructive.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#217

Post by aestra » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:14 PM UTC

Vik1ng wrote: post #154

potatolicious wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It does seem a bit unfair, but at the same time the reviews aren't just a measure of how much the bride and groom will enjoy the place, it's also a measure of how much everyone else does as well. Perhaps "many of your guests will hate this place" is a valuable signal to couples picking venues. Honestly, if you've been a legitimate guest of a particular venue IMO it's perfectly fine to leave a review about it. The peo…

But then it's just as valid to write a bad review about a McDonalds restaurant your group of friends decided to go to, because the wine selection sucked.

Valid? Yes. Reasonable? No.

As I mentioned before - there are unreasonable customers with a chip on their shoulder.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#218

Post by aestra » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:19 PM UTC

rrrx3 wrote: post #10

baddox wrote: post #3

If the hotel is clear about these terms, then I don't see much of a problem with this. It makes it really easy to know to pick a different hotel.

I should be stating the obvious here, but the fact that I even have to post this means that obviously, I am not. Just because something is written into the terms of an agreement doesn't make it legal.

I would really like to know what specific law(s) do you think this private party is violating? I am very curious. I can't think of any off the top of my head.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#219

Post by aestra » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:23 PM UTC

DanBC wrote: post #215

aestra wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I think Amazon has the right idea with the "Was this review helpful to you?" buttons Doubtful. "Was this review helpful to you?" is actually the "I disagree with this review" button in practice. Amazon reviews are so crappy. There is tons of reviews that say JUST "I haven't used this product/read this book yet." plus any number of stars.

> Amazon reviews are so crappy. There is tons of reviews that say JUST "I haven't used this product/read this book yet." plus any number of stars. While it's extra work I love those reviews. "I haven't read this book but $THING IS WRONG, thus one " mean I can ignore some of the low ratings. While reviews and ratings are weird and probably need some tweaking at some point[1] they are not nearly as bad as the weirdly b…

Found a review of such a nature

http://www.amazon.com/review/R35GSCGMDIAI9G/ref=cm_cr_pr_per...

>Have not read

>At this time I am caught up with so many pressing activites that is not one of my priorities. Will get to it probably this summer

One star review.

I agree completely about the searches. I'm starting to avoid Amazon cause I can't find what I want on there.

>"I haven't read this book but $THING IS WRONG, thus one " mean I can ignore some of the low ratings.

There are equal number of higher ratings and mid ratings of this nature.

Re: Hotel fines $500 for every bad review posted online

#220

Post by lifeisstillgood » Mon, Aug 04, 2014, 5:27 PM UTC

Wow - just for some perspective on yelp yesterday these guys had a four star rating.

At lunchtime (UK) today they had 39 reviews, and had dropped to 1.5 stars. At end of day UK they have over 500 reviews, as far as I can tell everyone a 1 star and they have 1 star rating.

One day and years of work undone.

For those who want to sell SEO services to real businesses (yelpEO?) this is a major marketing event. For some poor fucker in NY this is likely to be bankruptcy and layoffs.