Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill • Hacker News Board

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#241

Post by pbhjpbhj » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 1:35 PM UTC

dredmorbius wrote: post #51

schiffern wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is addressed in the article. >FAQ: It might work in Montana, but in Seattle, our windows would get moldy >There are a variety of ways to mitigate the mold problems that occur in cold, humid climates. I did some experimenting when I lived in the Seattle area and have compared notes with people that are still living there. This is a really large issues even if you don't try this. While there are many things to be…

Vinegar is also excellent at combating mold (before it gets established), and is gentle on pretty much any surface. A 50-50 vinegar-water solution can simply be sprayed onto walls, floors, carpets, and other surfaces. Another is fully airing out a bathroom. I'll set a fan to move air until the walls and other surfaces are dry. Especially useful if you've got an interior bathroom. Otherwise, an openable window is high…

>I'll set a fan to move air until the walls and other surfaces are dry. //

Aren't you just ensuring the whole house is damp then, unless your humidity is low enough in the first place I suppose.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#242

Post by cbr » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 1:44 PM UTC

driverdan wrote: post #89

nkozyra wrote: post #45

I live in Florida. This entire discussion is bizarro world for me. It costs nearly $400 a month to keep my house at 74deg in the summer.

Sounds like your house could use some work. It doesn't cost us that much to cool our sizable house here in Austin, even when it's 100+F every day.

Austin is much drier.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#243

Post by icantthinkofone » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 1:52 PM UTC

You can eliminate the need for an electric blanket by just getting a down-filled blanket. In a normally heated house, I would actually sweat under one. You can buy them in a "half down" style, which would be cooler, but, if the point is to allow you to turn the heat down, down blankets are the perfect thing.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#244

Post by rrss1122 » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 2:01 PM UTC

Cut out the personal electric heaters and you save even more.

I just wear a sweater as my personal heater. Heater only comes on for visitors.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#245

Post by microcolonel » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 2:18 PM UTC

dredmorbius wrote: post #67

OK, Paul Wheaton simply doesn't know what he's talking about: "I think that this does produce some savings, but not as much as you might think. If you set your thermostat to a constant 70, the heater works a little at a time throughout the day. If you drop it to 50 at night or in the middle of the day, the heater stops working, but then when the time comes to warm the house again, the heater has to work at full power…

Also doesn't know about heated toilet seats.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#246

Post by pflanze » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 2:28 PM UTC

Dylan16807 wrote: post #172

jlebar wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't know how people's desires can be "wasteful". In a world where people paid for the true cost of their energy use, this argument might fly. But in most of the world today, this isn't the case, not by a long shot. If you heated to "summer inside the house" and bought high-quality carbon offsets corresponding to your increased energy use, I think most people wouldn't call that "wasteful". "Warm" might be the ad…

The cost of carbon offsets is apparently less than a penny per kWh. This is barely anything in comparison to the price of the electricity itself, so it doesn't matter whether people are in actuality paying the true cost; they might as well be. Such a world would look almost identical to our own.

I couldn't believe this, so I checked around a bit.

According to [1], the cost for offsets are $5.50 to $29 per ton of CO2. According to [2], 1 kWh produces 2.08-2.18 lbs kg of CO2 when burning coal (0.94-0.99 kg). Thus, the cost for the offset is about 0.52-2.9 US cents/kWh, or when using different power sources[3], 0.32-1.7 US cents/kWh, hence your number is about right.

Now I guess the next thing to check is how solid those offset efforts really are. Also, probably they are cheap because they are the low-hanging fruits, I suspect that if everyone would offset their usage, the offset costs per kWh would become much higher. Thus, your assertion that the world would look almost identical if everyone would pay the true cost may well still be wrong.

[1] http://gogreen.whatitcosts.com/carbon-offsets.htm [2] http://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.cfm?id=74&t=11 [3] http://carbonfund.org/how-we-calculate "On average, electricity sources emit 1.222lbs CO2 per kWh (0.0005925 metric tons CO2 per kWh)"

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#247

Post by carlob » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 2:39 PM UTC

modoc wrote: post #229

carlob wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A few ideas: 1. Keep it at 80 for a couple of weeks, you'll get habituated quickly enough and will suffer less outside as a byproduct. 2. Use the AC only in the room you are actually in and close the door. 3. Unless it's very very very warm outside, and once you got used to higher temperatures a couple open windows or a simple fan will do wonders. Source: I live in Rome, I have AC but I only turn it on when it's over…

Everyone is a bit different. If it's over 76 degrees in my house, I am mentally more sluggish, and have a very hard time sleeping. I don't mind sweating and being hot during the day, but at night I just can't sleep well. Also my computer gear has a tendency to overheat when things get much over 80 in the house at large (home office runs hotter).

While the fact that everyone is different is true, I still think that it's also true that, with some effort, everyone can change their comfort level.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#248

Post by rdancer » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 3:08 PM UTC

XorNot wrote: post #92

Looking at this as conventional power savings is wrong. It's better to look at this as comfort. I just recently bought one of those 20 watt heat mats, for one specific reason: while using a computer it is impossible to keep my feet warm. Socks, boots, anything? Doesn't work. It was a huge problem while I was studying. Since I got one, for 20 W, my feet are warm. In fact, my perception of room temperature as a whole h…

Have you gone to true extremes? I have found that synthetic fur works extremely well, and is very comfortable, even with stone-cold floors.

I'm going to be buying pair of these for the upcoming winter; they're dirt-cheap, machine washable, and will last several seasons:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00FG1XINO/ref=oh_aui_det...

I have been thinking about thermal socks as well ( http://www.amazon.co.uk/Pairs-Mens-Thermal-Socks-Size/dp/B00... ), and furry boots for the great outdoors.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#249

Post by mikeash » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 3:25 PM UTC

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #240

mikeash wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Either the laws of physics are different than well established theory says they are... or your thermostat didn't do a very good job. I vote for the second one.

Putting in heat over a short time, to recover from low temperatures, is different to putting in heat over an extended period. If your heater has very low efficiency at high heat output then it seems highly possible that extended low output could be better. It's a financial efficiency we're talking about primarily when people are looking to more efficiently heat their house. If you're heating with electric for example…

Virtually all thermostat-controlled heating systems I've seen don't have different output levels, but are just on or off. So poor efficiency at high output wouldn't come into play.

The rest is possible, but I'd file using expensive electricity instead of cheap electricity under the thermostat not doing a very good job, or more precisely the person setting it up not doing a good job of setting it up to run more cheaply.

Re: Micro heaters cut 87% off my electric heat bill

#250

Post by upofadown » Thu, Jul 31, 2014, 3:30 PM UTC

lutorm wrote: post #17

This is why changing out incandescents for CFL's in a heated house does almost nothing for saving energy... and if the heat comes from electricity, nothing for saving money, either.

During heating season you are correct. During cooling season you end up paying twice for the extra energy consumption of incandescents. So it ends up being climate dependent. In cold countries the savings from changing out incandescents can be a fraction of the savings obtained in hot countries. Where I live you only end up getting half the benefit you would expect from the energy savings alone. If you don't have AC here then the benefit is even lower.

There is a current internet legend that the heat from incandescent bulbs does not contribute significantly to building heating. This is entirely wrong for the obvious thermodynamic reason. It's even been tested experimentally with the result that almost all the heat from the bulbs ends up as general heating:

http://www.cmhc.ca/odpub/pdf/65830.pdf