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Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

teslamotors.com

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Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#21

Post by jacquesm »

ksec wrote: post #17

Again as with my previous response, I still dont get why the need for a Gigafactory. Battery Industry are an extremely automated, high volume market and with profit margin in single digit. Cutting those off aren't going to automatically made electric cars affordable. Unless Telsa and Panasonic has jointly developed an revolutionary battery that is going to need some funding and mass produced. But any new battery will…

Making things in volume reduces the price. The profits on the batteries may be low (I'm not an insider so I have no idea what the profits are on these), but the profits on the cars (which Tesla makes) are reasonably high. It's like investing in infrastructure when you make something that uses that infrastructure, akin to a hosting facility investing the fibre optic lines that connect it.

Electric cars are already affordable, that's not the main sticking point (a fast way to charge them and a widely rolled out network of charging stations is).

If they manage to shave a few percentage points off the cost of production and create jobs in the process I don't see the problem.

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#22

Post by davman »

C7E0F338E42448 wrote: post #16
ck2 wrote: post #15

I want to own an electric car so badly in my lifetime. Really hope this makes that happen. They sure are quiet though, I worry about pets and wildlife. Gigafactory will employ about 6,500 people by 2020 Delivery truck drivers? I mean the factory is should be mostly automated by 2020.

where do you live, where owning an electric car in your lifetime seem like a distant dream? and why do you want to own one so badly?

Well I live in the UK, I've specced out a mid range Model S with a few optional extras so this comes in at £67000.

Lets assume by some miracle I manage to save up a £7000 deposit, this leaves me with some £60000 to find. At a quick google around its pretty hard to get car finance over £25000, but lets have a crack at it and try autotrader. They'll only let me borrow £50k over 60 months which gives me monthly payments of £958.

My monthly take home is £1800, so that leaves me with £852 to play with, my rent is £450 and my council tax is £101, so now we're down to £301 and I haven't paid for my utilities yet.

So an electric car in my lifetime (or at least one with a useful range like the Teslas) is a distant dream. At least until the Model 3.

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#23

Post by johansch »

jacquesm wrote: post #21
ksec wrote: post #17

Again as with my previous response, I still dont get why the need for a Gigafactory. Battery Industry are an extremely automated, high volume market and with profit margin in single digit. Cutting those off aren't going to automatically made electric cars affordable. Unless Telsa and Panasonic has jointly developed an revolutionary battery that is going to need some funding and mass produced. But any new battery will…

Making things in volume reduces the price. The profits on the batteries may be low (I'm not an insider so I have no idea what the profits are on these), but the profits on the cars (which Tesla makes) are reasonably high. It's like investing in infrastructure when you make something that uses that infrastructure, akin to a hosting facility investing the fibre optic lines that connect it. Electric cars are already aff…

Tesla says:

http://www.teslamotors.com/blog/gigafactory

"In cooperation with strategic battery manufacturing partners, we’re planning to build a large scale factory that will allow us to achieve economies of scale and minimize costs through innovative manufacturing, reduction of logistics waste, optimization of co-located processes and reduced overhead."

I guess that and also securing the supply chain for themselves as the rest of the car industry starts/continues to compete with them for the battery supply.

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#24

Post by SeanLuke »

jacquesm wrote: post #13
Kayou wrote: post #6

Why are most of the lithium cells cylindrical, while most of our devices are cuboid? (I think of phones, laptops, external battries... but phones and most laptops have flat lithium cells nowadays). Is cylindrical less expensive? Is it more secure? It seems like a waste of space to me.

It's an efficiency matter. The cylinder gives good electrode surface relative to the amount of matter contained. For a cube that ratio would be much worse, for a sphere it would be optimal, but spheres are harder to manufacture and connect to, as well as harder to stack in arrays. So we take a medium between the sphere and the cube and end up with a sweet spot in the cylindrical shape.

This doesn't explain why LiPoly batteries are cuboids.

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#25

Post by outworlder »

davman wrote: post #22
C7E0F338E42448 wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

where do you live, where owning an electric car in your lifetime seem like a distant dream? and why do you want to own one so badly?

Well I live in the UK, I've specced out a mid range Model S with a few optional extras so this comes in at £67000. Lets assume by some miracle I manage to save up a £7000 deposit, this leaves me with some £60000 to find. At a quick google around its pretty hard to get car finance over £25000, but lets have a crack at it and try autotrader. They'll only let me borrow £50k over 60 months which gives me monthly payments…

Are you working in IT?

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#28

Post by pptr1 »

This just shows me that Tesla is able to execute. The Gigafactory, opening up patents, rapidly growing charger network, and the eventual $35k Gen III tells me they have tons of potential in the future.

Tesla is thinking big. They want everyone in the world to eventually have a electric car. I think they will own a significant share of premium market after they release the Gen III.

However, they will be cars that people will desire at a cheaper price point than the Gen III, from different manufacturers. Also some people love certain car brands regardless of anything else, and mostly will stick to those brands. It will be great that those other car brands will be able to more easily make electric vehicles.

Those electric cars from other manufacturers will most likely have a Tesla battery and charge on Tesla charging station. I think this is true disruption.

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#29

Post by DannyBee »

pptr1 wrote: post #28

This just shows me that Tesla is able to execute. The Gigafactory, opening up patents, rapidly growing charger network, and the eventual $35k Gen III tells me they have tons of potential in the future. Tesla is thinking big. They want everyone in the world to eventually have a electric car. I think they will own a significant share of premium market after they release the Gen III. However, they will be cars that peop…

"opening up patents"

There is still no truly legally enforceable promise, that explains in detail, exactly what Elon is giving away and what he isn't, and what the terms are.

It's now 1.5 months later, and despite many people asking such a thing, nothing has been forthcoming at all.

So before you give them amazing amounts of credit for this, could we please wait till they actually do something more than PR?

Re: Panasonic and Tesla Sign Agreement for the Gigafactory

#30

Post by martin_bech »

pptr1 wrote: post #28

This just shows me that Tesla is able to execute. The Gigafactory, opening up patents, rapidly growing charger network, and the eventual $35k Gen III tells me they have tons of potential in the future. Tesla is thinking big. They want everyone in the world to eventually have a electric car. I think they will own a significant share of premium market after they release the Gen III. However, they will be cars that peop…

Im going to repeat myself.. They are going to do to alot of car manufactures, the same thing Apple did to Nokia and Blackberry..
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