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Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

polygon.com

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Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#61

Post by DanBC »

TheMagicHorsey wrote: post #30

What we must have is a network that enables a peer-to-peer trust rating for individuals. Sort of like Yelp, but for people. No doubt such a system would be a huge privacy problem for people as people would say that negative reviews reveal their private facts, or that those reviews are defamation. However, if the network is decentralized, then it might be possible to keep it running even in the face of opposition from…

Recent revelations show government agencies could manipulate online polls.

It would be trivially easy for them to poison this database.

> Rascals and scammers like these failed Kickstarter bros would be shut down after a single scam ... they would not be able to rent or scam another person after a single scam.

Well, you don't know they're a scammer until they've been to court and proved guilty or does no-one care about innocent until proven guilty anymore? And what's to stop them getting a new identity?

> Imagine the first time some innocent girl in high school is unjustly called a slut, and is defamed by her own school as part of some bullying clique.

That is a fucking awful example. You say "some innocent girl is unjustly called a slut" - this implies that if the girl was not innocent that it may be acceptable to call her a slut (as an insult). Then you say "[...] as part of some bullying clique" which implies that the problem is with the false accusation of sluttiness, and not with the fact that some bullying clique exists.

> I believe the network can ameliorate if not outright prevent such clique abuse by enabling users to rate reviewers based on the reviews they have given. If you abuse people with your reviews and ratings, it can damage your own ratings.

The clique just vote-rings and they cancel out bad votes. Or they buy votes off MTurk.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#62

Post by fancyketchup »

maxden wrote: post #28
uvTwitch wrote: post #20

Could the homeowner not simply have her power shut off to hasten the removal of these pests? If they're game developers, they'd be dependent on electricity.

There is a sms exchange here [0] where he does in fact say he does require electricity, and if they cut it off, he will press charges for blackmail and damages. Unfortunately it seems it will only be resolved with a lengthy eviction process. It is also interesting that there problems within the first few days. [0] http://www.businessinsider.com/airbnb-host-cant-get-squatter...

I wonder if a whole-house version of a lamp timer would be useful in this situation? Suppose there were a device that turned off power on a schedule, and which could only be reset from inside the apartment. Power would turn off automatically 12 hours after the lease terminates to "save power in an unoccupied unit."

That way, the owner isn't turning off power to constructively evict, but the power is off all the same.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#63

Post by aikah »

Spearchucker wrote: post #54
Nursie wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That sounds horrific, and basically like a trial by popularity. Count me out.

I'm not so sure. Privacy is a big deal for me, but I'd sign up to something like this. If: If it uses a mechanism like CardSpace ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_CardSpace ) had: => I own my own data (client-side encryption on my client) => I consent to others accessing my reputation. Note that access means others can see, not get a copy of, and not keep. => I can withhold my reputation completely, or delete it…

Something like this COULD work if done well. at the same time,it is also hard for one to protect oneself against identity thieft.But I guess this kind of public only social network could also be used by third party websites as an OAUTH provider. I post as little as possible on the web about myself in fear that others would use my identity for a scam.So if someone can fix that problem,it could be a killer product.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#64

Post by damian2000 »

If I was the owner, I'd be looking at all the possible ways I could to make their stay less comfortable - music at all hours of the night, faulty hot water system, power outages. Not very ethical, but what these guys are doing isn't ethical either.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#65

Post by _delirium »

thekevan wrote: post #57
_delirium wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That would be illegal in any jurisdiction I know of. I'm renting my current apartment; obviously my landlord cannot rent it out to someone else while I still live here. Now you might say: but what if you're living there illegally? Well, I'm not, say I! Now we have a civil disagreement over property and a contract, which is a matter for the courts to decide. If the landlord alleges I no longer have a right to use of t…

"That would be illegal in any jurisdiction I know of. I'm renting my current apartment; obviously my landlord cannot rent it out to someone else while I still live here." Right, you probably have a lease. If you had a squatter's lease--or a de facto lease--couldn't she just allow more squatters? I don't think what you say has direct bearing on this situation because you both entered into a specific agreement. There i…

It's not really squatting in this case, which is where someone takes up residence in a property they have never had a contractual right to, like building a log cabin on your farmland, and then living in it for years. That's a different set of laws.

This is rather a person who had a legitimate lease, but has violated or exceeded it. Here they clearly had a legal right to lease the apartment for the first 44 days: this lease was agreed to via AirBnB. And the renters paid the first 30 days of it. Now they refuse to pay for the remaining 14 days of the original agreement, and also refuse to vacate after 44 days. That falls squarely into eviction law: if someone previously had a legitimate lease but now the landlord alleges that they don't (because of nonpayment, exceeding agreed conditions, etc.), they can be evicted. How, exactly, depends on the country & state/province.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#66

Post by gambler »

TheMagicHorsey wrote: post #30

What we must have is a network that enables a peer-to-peer trust rating for individuals. Sort of like Yelp, but for people. No doubt such a system would be a huge privacy problem for people as people would say that negative reviews reveal their private facts, or that those reviews are defamation. However, if the network is decentralized, then it might be possible to keep it running even in the face of opposition from…

I honestly don't understand how anyone could even begin to think such system is a good idea. We already have credit ratings, they are far less invasive than what you've described, they cover only one particular aspect of trust and they still suck. It will only get worse from there.

The only rating system I've seen that mostly works is Ebay. The only reason it works is because it rates clear-cut transactions that are limited in time and scope, and where both parties have something to loose. And even there you have problems, like its notorious bias against sellers.

Decentralized system would be even easier to game.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#67

Post by enoch_r »

HarryHirsch wrote: post #56
TheMagicHorsey wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly wrong. Stasi files are held closely by the state. This network would be public, and everyone would be able to see what the scum are up to.

Say again how many Yelp reviews are genuine and how many are planted by SEO outfits? I doubt that 20 % of Stasi informers were double agents, if you led the Stasi on there were consequences.

It may be irrelevant to your analogy (it'd be more difficult to identify "personal bias" in reviews of people, after all), but the "20% of Yelp reviews are fake" meme is highly misleading. The study in question looked at what percentage of Yelp reviews were hidden, by Yelp, for looking "fake."[1] This provides us with little additional information on the percentage of visible Yelp reviews (which is what most people will assume you're talking about when you say "Yelp reviews") that are fake.

It's a bit like noting that 96% of Harvard applicants are rejected and concluding that "96% of Harvard students didn't deserve to get in," with the caveat that by "Harvard student" you mean "a student that applied to Harvard."

[1] http://people.hbs.edu/mluca/FakeItTillYouMakeIt.pdf

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#68

Post by aikah »

makomk wrote: post #51
lingben wrote: post #6

kickstarter is scammer heaven

Not only that, they don't give a fuck because they get a cut no matter what and have carefully disclaimed all liability. For example, remember how they made a big deal about changing their rules on hardware projects to protect backers after several scams made the news in a big way?[1] They've now quietly removed all those restrictions to make it easier to list scams, er, projects[2]. After all more projects equals mo…

IMHO Most backers are "religious" , in the sense it's spare money for them and they get some satisfaction in backing an idea,i really believe only a tiny minority of the backers really want a concrete product in the end ,otherwise I cant believe how some ridiculous projects could be backed 10xtimes the initial money asked. For businesses,backing something can be good PR too,a lot of business do it ,no matter what the outcome is.

People like me that are too paranoid or skeptical to give free money would never back anything to begin with.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#69

Post by andyfortson »

TheMagicHorsey wrote: post #30

What we must have is a network that enables a peer-to-peer trust rating for individuals. Sort of like Yelp, but for people. No doubt such a system would be a huge privacy problem for people as people would say that negative reviews reveal their private facts, or that those reviews are defamation. However, if the network is decentralized, then it might be possible to keep it running even in the face of opposition from…

There's a startup that's trying to do this: https://myrepp.com/. Not sure why they're not using this case as an opportunity to get some press.

Re: Notorious Airbnb squatter may be the dev behind two flailing Kickstarter games

#70

Post by pstuart »

_delirium wrote: post #31
gerner wrote: post #19

In some ways, this is the dark side of disrupting established industries: legal protections aren't in place yet; it's not clear what recourse people caught in never before seen corner cases have. We (e.g. HN folks) are quick to applaud people with new ideas that are shaking things up (e.g. Airbnb, Uber, etc.) I suspect this is the sort of scenario detractors (e.g. Seattle City Council re: Uber) are worried about. Ter…

I'm not sure these are "never before seen corner cases". This kind of stuff is pretty much Landlording 101, and it's standard practice for someone engaged in renting a property to know about eviction laws. This person wasn't even engaging in what you might call the new, casual-sharing-of-personal-possessions style of rental, where someone rents their own personal apartment out occasionally while they're on vacation.…

But Airbnb, as a service, should at least filter/advise for knowingly stupid things like renting out for such an extended period.
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