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Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

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Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#21

Post by bnejad »

kkilat wrote: post #14
pc86 wrote: post #12

I see in one of the screenshots there is a 3.9% fee - is that your fee as well as credit card processing?

Yep, that's Stripe's 2.9% credit card processing fee, and then 1% that we take. Our goal in the future is to open up and accept other online payment options that have lower overall fees, as well though. We definitely want you to keep as much of the money you've earned as possible, and get it as fast as possible!

You may want to make that clear somewhere on your website. I don't want to click "Try Now" before I can see the terms/pricing/etc

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#22

Post by davedx »

tijs wrote: post #20

Is it normal in the US to pay supplier invoices through credit card payments? Nobody would pay 3,9% on amounts of more than a few hundred dollars right? A normal project invoice for say a web studio would usually be well over 10k which means you're regularly paying more than $400 to get a single invoice processed? Am i missing something or do people actually do this? Not trying to be snarky, truly curious.

In my limited experience, it's not usual. My US clients have paid with Paypal, bank transfer and check.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#23

Post by davedx »

tadmilbourn wrote: post #2

We’re taking a slightly different approach to invoicing for billable hours. From talking with freelancers, independent contractors, agencies, and other professional services companies, we found that there’s a significant delay between when work is done and when the invoice actually goes out. Then, there’s even more delay between when that invoice goes out and when it gets paid. We’re trying to reduce both of those de…

In my experience as a contractor, the payment period is usually in the contract. The terms I've seen the most are 30 days and my current contract is 35 days.

No amount of reducing friction will reduce that payment period. I know of one contractor who negotiated a higher rate by increasing the period. Companies typically run long invoice cycles, and you don't stand a chance of changing that to anything shorter usually.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#24

Post by tijs »

davedx wrote: post #22
tijs wrote: post #20

Is it normal in the US to pay supplier invoices through credit card payments? Nobody would pay 3,9% on amounts of more than a few hundred dollars right? A normal project invoice for say a web studio would usually be well over 10k which means you're regularly paying more than $400 to get a single invoice processed? Am i missing something or do people actually do this? Not trying to be snarky, truly curious.

In my limited experience, it's not usual. My US clients have paid with Paypal, bank transfer and check.

Let's just say that compared to 0$ for a bank transfer (at least where i'm from) it seems like a bad deal.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#25

Post by tadmilbourn »

tijs wrote: post #20

Is it normal in the US to pay supplier invoices through credit card payments? Nobody would pay 3,9% on amounts of more than a few hundred dollars right? A normal project invoice for say a web studio would usually be well over 10k which means you're regularly paying more than $400 to get a single invoice processed? Am i missing something or do people actually do this? Not trying to be snarky, truly curious.

Great points. We've actually talked to folks whose total fees were about 6% after all was said and done. It's crazy, but it does happen.

In your example, what I'd ask is if the web studio would be willing to pay $400 to get that $10k weeks earlier than they otherwise would have. That might be a good cash flow outcome for them.

All that being said, you're exactly right, the fee structure makes transactions of a certain size not make sense if you're doing more regular invoicing. That's why we want to add more payment methods over time that are lower cost.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#26

Post by tadmilbourn »

bnejad wrote: post #21
kkilat wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, that's Stripe's 2.9% credit card processing fee, and then 1% that we take. Our goal in the future is to open up and accept other online payment options that have lower overall fees, as well though. We definitely want you to keep as much of the money you've earned as possible, and get it as fast as possible!

You may want to make that clear somewhere on your website. I don't want to click "Try Now" before I can see the terms/pricing/etc

Thanks! That's an oversight on our part. We'll make that more clear in the next iteration of that page.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#27

Post by tadmilbourn »

tghw wrote: post #19
kkilat wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, that's Stripe's 2.9% credit card processing fee, and then 1% that we take. Our goal in the future is to open up and accept other online payment options that have lower overall fees, as well though. We definitely want you to keep as much of the money you've earned as possible, and get it as fast as possible!

This service is worth 1% of my income? On top of 2.9% fees? For some reason, I have trouble believing that it'd be worth my while.

That's what we're hoping to prove. We've had early customers get paid in less than an hour (compared to 3-4 weeks). It was worth the 1% to them to get their money (averaging about $2,000) faster.

Now, with increased traffic and user from things like this Show HN, we're hoping to show that we can sustain those positive early indicators at greater scale.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#28

Post by tijs »

tadmilbourn wrote: post #25
tijs wrote: post #20

Is it normal in the US to pay supplier invoices through credit card payments? Nobody would pay 3,9% on amounts of more than a few hundred dollars right? A normal project invoice for say a web studio would usually be well over 10k which means you're regularly paying more than $400 to get a single invoice processed? Am i missing something or do people actually do this? Not trying to be snarky, truly curious.

Great points. We've actually talked to folks whose total fees were about 6% after all was said and done. It's crazy, but it does happen. In your example, what I'd ask is if the web studio would be willing to pay $400 to get that $10k weeks earlier than they otherwise would have. That might be a good cash flow outcome for them. All that being said, you're exactly right, the fee structure makes transactions of a certai…

Sure, earlier payment might very well make it wortwhile. Maybe, if you have validated numbers, that should be part of the pitch on the invoices page? (x% of our customers get paid in x weeks)

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#29

Post by tadmilbourn »

davedx wrote: post #23
tadmilbourn wrote: post #2

We’re taking a slightly different approach to invoicing for billable hours. From talking with freelancers, independent contractors, agencies, and other professional services companies, we found that there’s a significant delay between when work is done and when the invoice actually goes out. Then, there’s even more delay between when that invoice goes out and when it gets paid. We’re trying to reduce both of those de…

In my experience as a contractor, the payment period is usually in the contract. The terms I've seen the most are 30 days and my current contract is 35 days. No amount of reducing friction will reduce that payment period. I know of one contractor who negotiated a higher rate by increasing the period. Companies typically run long invoice cycles, and you don't stand a chance of changing that to anything shorter usually…

That's a fair point. It's going to be tough to change those types of companies because they tend to have people that manage and optimize cash flow (i.e. pay bills on the last day possible without incurring penalties).

From our experience with small businesses Intuit (the Tiempo team is all former Intuit employees), we know there's a large swath of companies that aren't as complicated or as rigorous. For those companies, just getting the bill taken care of and out of the way is a benefit. Those are the companies we'll focus on first.

Re: Show HN: Tiempo – The fastest way to track time and get paid

#30

Post by sanityinc »

tijs wrote: post #20

Is it normal in the US to pay supplier invoices through credit card payments? Nobody would pay 3,9% on amounts of more than a few hundred dollars right? A normal project invoice for say a web studio would usually be well over 10k which means you're regularly paying more than $400 to get a single invoice processed? Am i missing something or do people actually do this? Not trying to be snarky, truly curious.

Not only that, but the payment might end up being charged back up to 180 days (or even longer) later.
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