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GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

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Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#171
post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like you don't even need the hard part for a viable product: range extender for cell phones targeted at people engaged in outdoor activities but parked somewhere with cell phone reception.

Technically, this has been possible for a long time, but it is not allowed for regulatory reasons, and those regulations are not just there because somebody enjoys being a killjoy. Radio transmission and networks are a complex subject matter. Most of all, they're a scarce, common resource and it's easy to mess things up for others. If you want real off the grid connectivity, buy or rent a sat phone or a satellite eme…

If there were a band of legitimately useful long range spectrum that was a free for all, wouldn't there be a strong economic incentive for people to invent modulation techniques capable of functioning effectively in such a noisy environment?

Alternatively, wouldn't it be conceivable for transmitting nodes to cooperate with one another to send transmissions. For example, if N nodes all transmit encrypted content on the same band to M receivers, then the signals of all but one of those N transmitters look like noise to each of the M receivers, thus limiting the transmission rate achievable over any given channel. If instead of that approach, what if a transmitter instead used a second frequency solely for the purpose of coordinating transmissions with the other nodes so as to minimize interference which each other. In addition to coordinating when they are or are not transmitting, couldn't they selective choose different modulation techniques that are easily distinguishable from one another, and thus transmittable simultaneously.

Feel free to educate or correct me here. I know very little about this domain.

Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the time. We live in NYC and have gotten anywhere from 0.5 mile to 3.5 miles range here, depending what part of the city you're in. There's nearly no such thing as LOS in a city unless, say, you're in a skyscraper ;)

Ah, I'm just surprised that buildings ended up mattering when you were deciding between 150MHz or 900MHz. While people like to complain about the frequency getting higher and propagation dropping off (especially related to 2.4GHz and 5GHz wifi), I haven't found a good paper that guarantees that's the case. Anecdotally, I can receive a 5GHz signal in my office in Manhattan from a radar in Floyd Bennett Field, 12 miles…

No on the noise floor question ;)

Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If somebody reverse engineers their API and their devices are being used illegally for mesh networking, the most likely thing is not a mesh networking revolution [1], but the FCC taking their devices off the market. Daniela's reply to your posting could be seen as endorsing this, which won't help. [1] you can legally do this in other bands, and there are some pretty cool open source projects.

Totally agree on how the FCC might react, but I don't see how you interpreted Daniela's response as an endorsement of reverse engineering their APIs to enable illegal mesh networking.

Right ;)

Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#174

A consumer-friendly, open version of amateur radio's APRS network would be really cool. This seems like the first step, though I don't know if they intend to open the protocol. Also, 50 mile range sounds great, but that's under "ideal" conditions, which happens roughly never. I'm curious what the range would be in the real world.

> 50 mile range sounds great, but that's under "ideal" conditions, which happens roughly never. I'm curious what the range would be in the real world. In that graphic, change the elevation to 6ft and you get much more realistic ranges. The default elevation is 500ft (top of a small hill). I'm a HAM operator, that device's frequency is just a bit above our very popular 2m band. The ranges they indicate at more realist…

Weren't police bands (previously) right about there? My license lapsed a few years back, but if memory serves, some people would do some minor surgery on their 2m radios so they could tune in to police bands just above 2m. I assume police all use some fancy digital microwave comms now.

Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> 50 mile range sounds great, but that's under "ideal" conditions, which happens roughly never. I'm curious what the range would be in the real world. In that graphic, change the elevation to 6ft and you get much more realistic ranges. The default elevation is 500ft (top of a small hill). I'm a HAM operator, that device's frequency is just a bit above our very popular 2m band. The ranges they indicate at more realist…

Weren't police bands (previously) right about there? My license lapsed a few years back, but if memory serves, some people would do some minor surgery on their 2m radios so they could tune in to police bands just above 2m. I assume police all use some fancy digital microwave comms now.

"some people would do some minor surgery on their 2m radios so they could tune in to police bands just above 2m"

Probably, but you could also just buy a police scanner from Radio Shack, or even a $10 TV tuner that can be used as an SDR: http://sdr.osmocom.org/trac/wiki/rtl-sdr

In fact I think those cheap Boafeng radios will even transmit on those frequencies. Of course that would be highly illegal.

"fancy digital microwave comms now"

Microwave radios are only really used for point-to-point links, as the shorter wavelengths require line-of-sight.

They are using digital trunking systems (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trunked_radio_system), and encryption in some cases.

Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Weren't police bands (previously) right about there? My license lapsed a few years back, but if memory serves, some people would do some minor surgery on their 2m radios so they could tune in to police bands just above 2m. I assume police all use some fancy digital microwave comms now.

"some people would do some minor surgery on their 2m radios so they could tune in to police bands just above 2m" Probably, but you could also just buy a police scanner from Radio Shack, or even a $10 TV tuner that can be used as an SDR: http://sdr.osmocom.org/trac/wiki/rtl-sdr In fact I think those cheap Boafeng radios will even transmit on those frequencies. Of course that would be highly illegal. "fancy digital mic…

My Yaesu FT-817 transceiver has continuous, gapless tuning from the bottom of long-wave radio to the top of UHF - at least on the receiving side.

I'm pretty sure there's a simple hack to also make it transmit on any arbitrary frequency - but that's illegal, of course.

http://www.yaesu.com/indexVS.cfm?cmd=DisplayProducts&ProdCat...

Re: GoTenna – Send and receive messages even when you don’t have service

#178
They say that you can take it anywhere. But is it legal to use anywhere? It's not using any worldwide ISM band, so I assume they're bit lost with this topic too. So you can take it anywhere, but you can't use it legally everywhere.
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