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Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

dfs.ny.gov

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Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#11

Post by bjt »

rektide wrote: post #2

Rrriiight. Good luck making it past the Commerce Clause, trying to thieve what is an enshrined Federal power ("To regulate Commerce with foreign Nations, and among the several States, and with the Indian Tribes"). Who are these chumps that so enjoy playing with themselves in the public forum? Why do they think they're not stepping all over the constitution by imposing burdens on commercial activities that happen to i…

The states are what give the constitution its authority, not vice versa. The commerce clause is part of the fed govt's "enumerated" powers, meaning that the fed govt only has the powers listed in the Constitution. The states, however, have the "police power", letting them pass pretty much whatever laws they want.

When it comes to the commerce clause, courts have decided to let states do what they want, more or less, unless a specific federal law "preempts" the state one.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#12

Post by mrfusion »

dmix wrote: post #7

Here is a Reddit comment breaking down the proposal: http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/2aycxs/hi_this_is_b...

This line saddened me, "In fact, Satoshi would have commited a crime creating Bitcoin without registration. (200.2n5)"

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#13

Post by innguest »

This is absolutely ridiculous.

That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable.

They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof?

Where's the torrent regulation PDF? These folks are clowns.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#14

Post by wmf »

innguest wrote: post #13

This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof? Where's the torrent regulatio…

It sounds like you're saying that if I create something I can simply declare it to be exempt from any laws I don't like. The whole point of laws is that they're not voluntary.

As for torrents, there is that thing called copyright law.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#15

Post by wdewind »

innguest wrote: post #13

This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof? Where's the torrent regulatio…

> They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency.

It is extraordinarily easy to point out how shitty a job the Fed has been doing from a society that completely depends on it. When you compare how the American financial system has been doing compared to the rest of the world the results are astoundingly in our favor.

I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way.

Propose, for instance, how HSBC would be prevented from laundering money for literal international terrorists and drug dealers. Or remittances, another Btc enthusiast favorite: do you really think the fees you are paying Western Union are related to flipping bits and not to keeping massive stores of cash, securely, in remote locations? Maybe some day cash wont be necessary, but we are extremely far from that point, and until we are there Btc remittances are essentially useless.

> That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable.

That some part of our culture thinks it is reasonable to create a new currency and not have the government regulate it is laughable.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#16

Post by slg »

wdewind wrote: post #15
innguest wrote: post #13

This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof? Where's the torrent regulatio…

> They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. It is extraordinarily easy to point out how shitty a job the Fed has been doing from a society that completely depends on it. When you compare how the American financial system has been doing compared to the rest of the world the results are astoundingly in our favor. I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thorou…

>I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way.

A large percentage of the Bitcoin community's view on this front appears to be "past regulations have occasionally failed, therefore we shouldn't have any regulations." This makes no sense. It would be like your home being broken into and so you decide that you are better of leaving your door unlocked.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#17

Post by wdewind »

slg wrote: post #16
wdewind wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. It is extraordinarily easy to point out how shitty a job the Fed has been doing from a society that completely depends on it. When you compare how the American financial system has been doing compared to the rest of the world the results are astoundingly in our favor. I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thorou…

>I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thoroughly discount how well our current system actually functions. There are no questions that there are deficiencies in the current system, but the Btc community hasn't seemed to even identify what they actually are, much less propose solutions in any reasonable way. A large percentage of the Bitcoin community's view on this front appears to be "past…

> It would be like your home being broken into and so you decide that you are better of leaving your door unlocked.

Couldn't agree more. TLDR: bring back Glass Steagall.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#18

Post by TylerE »

wdewind wrote: post #15
innguest wrote: post #13

This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof? Where's the torrent regulatio…

> They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. It is extraordinarily easy to point out how shitty a job the Fed has been doing from a society that completely depends on it. When you compare how the American financial system has been doing compared to the rest of the world the results are astoundingly in our favor. I find it difficult to understand how Bitcoin enthusiasts can so thorou…

Of course, "The Fed" actually isn't part of the government.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#19

Post by _archon_ »

wmf wrote: post #10
mrfusion wrote: post #9

What happens if the entities aren't based in NY?

If they have any customers in NY they need to follow NY laws. This is one of the problems with money transfer laws in the US.

This is an interesting question and answer. I personally believe that legislation will be forced to change so that de jure can more closely resemble de facto... But this will not happen (anytime soon) while NY lawmakers think they can tax or regulate something.

Re: Proposed New York State Virtual Currency Regulations [pdf]

#20

Post by jerf »

innguest wrote: post #13

This is absolutely ridiculous. That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable. They've done (and continue to do) enough harm regulating their fiat currency. Who gives them the right, and more importantly, how can they be so delusional to think they can actually regulate something that is built in such a way as to be regulation-proof? Where's the torrent regulatio…

'That some part of "The Government" thinks they can regulate something that is not theirs is laughable.'

Bwuh? I can not come up with a sensible interpretation of this sentence. And I've tried.

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