The problem is that for people living outside the US, we already have the right side of the infographic. All our data is vacuumed in and used with impunity and nobody gives a damn whether we want it or not. Most of the discussion so far has been about the circumstances and illegality of spying after US citizens. Meanwhile, the rest of the world is left watching like second or third class human beings who can't have _any_ realistic expectations with regard to having privacy of their data used by US companies (which dominate the market due to several reasons)
CISPA is back with a new name
21–30 of 42 posts
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#22This is the problem. It's less effort for them to keep bringing it back under different names/guises, than it is for the general public to continue fighting it, continue raising enough attention against it, etc. People are lazy. You can rile them up to get critical mass for an action every now and then, but you can't sustain it forever.
Precisely the reason why government can never represent the will of the people. For regular people it's hard to project their will onto government, but for rich entities with lobbyists it is much easier. A politician, after elected, has very little incentive to serve his voters and all the incentives in the world to serve those who give him money. Voters, unlike lobbyists, cannot stop paying [tax] money.
> but for rich entities with lobbyists it is much easier
I still don't understand why lobbying - a socially accepted form of corruption - still exists, without being questioned. Even more so as, today, everybody knows that 1% control most of the wealth == lobbying == legislation == our lives.
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#23The UK is also passing "emergency" data retention legislation just before Parliament closes for summer and before the data is deleted. http://dataretentionandinvestigatorypowersbill.uk
I just checked my MP on Twitter. So far one person has tweeted to her about it. It makes me think the levels of apathy are just too high here for anybody to make a difference.
Well, I contacted my MP. I'm not holding my breath with this voting record:
* Voted very strongly against paying higher benefits over longer periods for those unable to work due to illness or disability
* Voted very strongly for increasing the rate of VAT
* Voted very strongly against raising welfare benefits at least in line with prices
* Voted very strongly for reducing central government funding of local government
* Voted a mixture of for and against a wholly elected House of Lords
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#24Earlier quoted context omitted.
Could an alternative DNS system fix this? Tor for DNS that both masked the lookup and the resulting IP would stop any type of filtering/blocking/take down etc? Coupled with https, to stop packet inspection?
Social and political problems are rarely fixed with engineering solutions.
Well, they are rarely fixed by engineering solutions that just try to hide the activity / behavior from view, and ignore the fact that it's a social/political problem.
I can easily come up with 'engineering solutions' to solve social / political problems, but it's usually paired with some sort of social/political action (e.g. engineering cheap weapons to supply a violent revolution).
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#25"Places online where you can expect privacy: Facebook" I'd rather be spied upon by NSA any day over Facebook. Atleast then I know how my information is being used. But oh right, NSA doesn't have a website where you can show off your socio economic status.
Facebook's never imprisoned or tortured anyone that I'm aware of. Maybe that'll be in a future rollout.
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#26Earlier quoted context omitted.
Precisely the reason why government can never represent the will of the people. For regular people it's hard to project their will onto government, but for rich entities with lobbyists it is much easier. A politician, after elected, has very little incentive to serve his voters and all the incentives in the world to serve those who give him money. Voters, unlike lobbyists, cannot stop paying [tax] money.
> but for rich entities with lobbyists it is much easier I still don't understand why lobbying - a socially accepted form of corruption - still exists, without being questioned. Even more so as, today, everybody knows that 1% control most of the wealth == lobbying == legislation == our lives.
I agree, except the alternative is worse.
The intent of lobbying is to inform elected officials about issues that they do not necessarily know anything about. The bribery aspect really has more to do with campaign contributions than lobbying, though lobbying can indirectly use those contributions, as well as a lot of societal norms to get its own way (you spend a lot of time discussing issues with someone, even when that someone is biased, and it's a bit rude to vote against them).
Without lobbyists, we have a bunch of uninformed, extremely partisan, mostly white, mostly old, mostly men deciding law, and that's probably even worse.
I don't know the fix; certainly, limiting the amount of lobbying corporations can do is likely part of it, but I would not want to also limit the ability of the ACLU and EFF from being able to talk to Congress, either.
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#27Earlier quoted context omitted.
> but for rich entities with lobbyists it is much easier I still don't understand why lobbying - a socially accepted form of corruption - still exists, without being questioned. Even more so as, today, everybody knows that 1% control most of the wealth == lobbying == legislation == our lives.
I agree, except the alternative is worse. The intent of lobbying is to inform elected officials about issues that they do not necessarily know anything about. The bribery aspect really has more to do with campaign contributions than lobbying, though lobbying can indirectly use those contributions, as well as a lot of societal norms to get its own way (you spend a lot of time discussing issues with someone, even when…
I personally think that removing the "burden" of voting on so many issues from congress and giving it directly to the people through online voting would be a potential solution.
Verification of votes would be very possible. If it did get hacked then fix the security hole, wipe the system, and vote again.
It would never happen because of self-interest in congress and they'd argue "but normal citizens are too dumb to decide for themselves".
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
Could an alternative DNS system fix this? Tor for DNS that both masked the lookup and the resulting IP would stop any type of filtering/blocking/take down etc? Coupled with https, to stop packet inspection?
Social and political problems are rarely fixed with engineering solutions.
This. They can help mitigate the damage, and be a force for change, but - to paraphrase Schneier - these systems are robust legally, technically and politically - we need to fight on all fronts to defeat them, and just winning once won't do it, we have to keep fighting back against abusive laws, systems and politicians because they will keep trying until they get whatever they want, at every stage.
We can't magic rogue institutions, politicians and laws away with maths. But it can have an impact on the practical damage they can do.
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#29Earlier quoted context omitted.
> but for rich entities with lobbyists it is much easier I still don't understand why lobbying - a socially accepted form of corruption - still exists, without being questioned. Even more so as, today, everybody knows that 1% control most of the wealth == lobbying == legislation == our lives.
I agree, except the alternative is worse. The intent of lobbying is to inform elected officials about issues that they do not necessarily know anything about. The bribery aspect really has more to do with campaign contributions than lobbying, though lobbying can indirectly use those contributions, as well as a lot of societal norms to get its own way (you spend a lot of time discussing issues with someone, even when…
While we're at it why don't we fix campaigning too? Limit how much politicians can get from corporations. What are we the Mafia?
Re: CISPA is back with a new name
#30The infographic mentions that "Corporate lobbyists have spent $605 million to get this legislation passed".
These pages show which corporations are supporting this (links towards the bottom):
http://maplight.org/us-congress/bill/113-hr-624/1202831/tota...
http://maplight.org/us-congress/bill/113-hr-624/1202831/tota...