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Cylinders in Spheres

datagenetics.com

11–20 of 60 posts

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#11
post #4

It wasn't (initially) clear to me that the cylindrical hole must enter and exit the sphere. With that knowledge the solution seems pretty intuitive.

Nor that the endcap(s) would not be included in either the 6 inches or the resulting volume. It seems to me that there must be a much better phrasing that brings these points home, although it might require a diagram.

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#12
post #8
post #2

The cheat is absolutely brilliant reasoning.

Ehh, sort of. It's logically flawed as phrased, in that the first bit is false: "If the problem is being posed, it must have a constant solution" is false; it could just as well be a niftily-simple symbolic solution too. (I say "as phrased" because as other commenters observe, there are mathematically valid ways to arrive at the result.) This reminds me of one of my favorite joke proofs from when I was in school. (It…

Its flawed as a "proof", but it might contextually justify the answer. That exact reasoning accounts for pretty much all of my limited success at middle school/high school math competitions. You can usually skip long, difficult steps by simply assuming there is a single constant answer (as the rules of the contests usually make clear must be the case).

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#13

It reminds me of two other neat problems - 1. Imagine a band stretched taught around the diameter of the earth (which, for the purposes of this question, is a smooth sphere). Now imagine that the band is raised one metre from the ground at every single point along its length. How much longer is it? 2. Imagine perfectly parallel lines painted on the floor, exactly one foot apart, and a rigid needle of length one foot.…

Maybe I am missing something here, but why is 1 a neat problem? You are increasing the radius by 1 meter so the length of the band is now 2pi(r_e + 1) making the increment 2*pi meters. Is the surprisingly low increment the point of the problem?

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#14

I remember reading and solving this the problem as the end of the article (“A six inch high cylindrical hole is drilled through the center of a sphere. How much volume is left in the sphere?”) as a kid. I did it the hard way using the formula's, but the whole point of the puzzle was what this article called the "cheat" answer. It reduces the solution to utter simplicity by application of some elegant logic. It's not…

It only wouldn't be a cheat if the question were framed as "Surprisingly, the volume of the ring is constant, regardless of the radii of the sphere and circle. What is that constant volume?" Otherwise, you don't really know your answer is correct. Maybe, they wanted the answer in terms of R1 and R2. And if you are able to trick them into confirming it, then you're essentially using social engineering to leverage somebody else's work (the person who discovered the surprising result) in formulating your answer. There's no way that the original discoverer could have used that method. That's what makes it a cheat.

Back in middle school geometry, I came up with my own strategy for proving theorems. "You wouldn't ask me to prove it if it weren't true, therefore it must be true. Q.E.D." It didn't go over well.

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#15
post #13

It reminds me of two other neat problems - 1. Imagine a band stretched taught around the diameter of the earth (which, for the purposes of this question, is a smooth sphere). Now imagine that the band is raised one metre from the ground at every single point along its length. How much longer is it? 2. Imagine perfectly parallel lines painted on the floor, exactly one foot apart, and a rigid needle of length one foot.…

Maybe I am missing something here, but why is 1 a neat problem? You are increasing the radius by 1 meter so the length of the band is now 2 pi (r_e + 1) making the increment 2*pi meters. Is the surprisingly low increment the point of the problem?

Most people when faced with 1 and knowing the huge circumference of the Earth estimate (using Sytem 1 type thinking, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dual_process_theory#System_1) it would be longer by kilometers.

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#16
post #13

It reminds me of two other neat problems - 1. Imagine a band stretched taught around the diameter of the earth (which, for the purposes of this question, is a smooth sphere). Now imagine that the band is raised one metre from the ground at every single point along its length. How much longer is it? 2. Imagine perfectly parallel lines painted on the floor, exactly one foot apart, and a rigid needle of length one foot.…

Maybe I am missing something here, but why is 1 a neat problem? You are increasing the radius by 1 meter so the length of the band is now 2 pi (r_e + 1) making the increment 2*pi meters. Is the surprisingly low increment the point of the problem?

Yes, exactly; if you don't start out by doing the math, the result can seem unintuitive.

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#17

It reminds me of two other neat problems - 1. Imagine a band stretched taught around the diameter of the earth (which, for the purposes of this question, is a smooth sphere). Now imagine that the band is raised one metre from the ground at every single point along its length. How much longer is it? 2. Imagine perfectly parallel lines painted on the floor, exactly one foot apart, and a rigid needle of length one foot.…

If you read to the bottom of the cylinder article, there's a link to another blog post by the same guy about other Martin Gardner puzzles, and the 'band around the Earth' puzzle is the first one!

http://www.datagenetics.com/blog/may12012/index.html

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#19
post #7

One of those cases where using integrals rather than geometry is much simpler. \pi \int_-3^3 (R^2 - x^2) dx = \pi (6 R^2 - 18) is the volume of the rotational solid without removing the cylinder. While the volume of the cylinder is given by: \pi \int_-3^3 (R^2 - 3^2) dx = \pi 6 (R^2 - 9) As you can see the difference between the two volumes is 36 \pi. You can actually show the solution does not depend on \pi without…

Nit: the solution doesn’t depend on “R” (as you note, this is clear from looking at the structure of the two integrals); it does depend on \pi.

Re: Cylinders in Spheres

#20
post #4

It wasn't (initially) clear to me that the cylindrical hole must enter and exit the sphere. With that knowledge the solution seems pretty intuitive.

How can one drill a 6" long hole through a sphere of more than 6 inches in diameter?

What I mean is if you drill 6 inches into the earth, you haven't passed through the other side...

edit: I think they mean drill a 6 inch hole of maximum width, which of course would just leave a very thin ring of the earth 6 inches tall.

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