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FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

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Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#111

Post by gpvos »

Fuxy wrote: post #94
baddox wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The laws already changed to give them these powers - the 2012 FAA Modernization Act authorizes the FAA to make rules about UAS. So claims the FAA. I can't make my way through the text of the law, nor can I find any legal summary or analysis other than the FAA's own claim that it gives them the authority to regulate UAS.

Everybody is arguing if they have the authority or not the more important question is why do they want to? I find the FAA's attempt at banning anything commercial relating to drones a bit curious. Step 1. Ban/regulate all commercial Drones. Step 2. Require a license for commercial use. Step 3. Profit?

The FAA's goal in life is to ensure safety in the air. Drones are obviously within their field of interest. When commercial drones take off, there will obviously be a lot more drones in the air than the recreational drones and toy aircraft now, since there is a lot of money to be made, while comparatively few people fly things for a hobby.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#113

Post by sfk »

exDM69 wrote: post #106

This is the only sensible (but temporary) decision that the FAA could have done. The next step is to research reliable methods of navigation and air traffic rules for unmanned and autonomous aerial vehicles, and when that can be made demonstrably safe, this regulation can be revisited. If FAA would have allowed commercial drone operations without further regulation, and the technology would have had widespread adopti…

I think the ban should stay regardless of safety. One big issue here is noise and visual pollution.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#114

Post by naterator »

drawkbox wrote: post #83

I'd like the US to be the innovators on drone deliveries but it looks like we'll pass that opportunity up. Maybe we can outlaw any form of driverless car as well. Just as both are getting to be new markets that could increase economic growth. Drones, if they are more efficient than truck deliveries from a cost and energy use perspective, for most things they will be the solution used. It is just does the US want that…

Silicon Valley and the tech sector is full of adult babies. Watching the twitter reaction to this news (and others) is pretty fascinating. You're all so doom-and-gloom the first second the government tries to regulate something. Let's not discuss the histrionics that come out on other topics. Further, you act like there could be no possible logical reason why these things should be regulated. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of onerous regulation or regulatory capture, but you guys are just a bunch of babies.

I think there should be rules about drones, because I can easily think of several really fucking bad things that could happen if everyone who wants to tinker can just fly their drones around because they've got the money and know how. What happens if Amazon tries to deliver a package, but the software fucks up and the drone flies over the airport (assuming the engineers even thought of that problem in advance)? What happens when multiple business start flying drones around and they start crashing into one another, falling on people, highways, or whatever? I've seen a video where a guy decapitated himself with his gas powered toy helicopter. Are these drones going to be safe if they crash into me, or should I walk around with a shotgun?

We need rules. We don't need onerous rules, but we need rules.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#115

Post by exDM69 »

sfk wrote: post #113
exDM69 wrote: post #106

This is the only sensible (but temporary) decision that the FAA could have done. The next step is to research reliable methods of navigation and air traffic rules for unmanned and autonomous aerial vehicles, and when that can be made demonstrably safe, this regulation can be revisited. If FAA would have allowed commercial drone operations without further regulation, and the technology would have had widespread adopti…

I think the ban should stay regardless of safety. One big issue here is noise and visual pollution.

I appreciate your opinion and recognize that there are many people who share your opinion but I can't agree. Compared to road and air traffic, it would take a serious amount of drones to match the noise and visual pollution.

The pizza delivery man with his car or scooter makes more noise and takes more space than a drone would.

And you have to remember that the early jet aircraft were very noisy and inefficient compared to modern jets. NACA, NASA and the FAA did some serious research and development programs in the fifties and sixties to reduce the amount of noise.

Compared to "big" aviation, I think that the current drones are somewhere in between the Wright brothers and the Spirit of St. Louis - I guess there will be significant development in the near future.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#116

Post by Argorak »

exDM69 wrote: post #115
sfk wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the ban should stay regardless of safety. One big issue here is noise and visual pollution.

I appreciate your opinion and recognize that there are many people who share your opinion but I can't agree. Compared to road and air traffic, it would take a serious amount of drones to match the noise and visual pollution. The pizza delivery man with his car or scooter makes more noise and takes more space than a drone would. And you have to remember that the early jet aircraft were very noisy and inefficient compa…

On the other hand, the pizza delivery man stays on the road and does not fly in front of my office back window at random times of the day.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#117

Post by jsmcgd »

sfk wrote: post #113
exDM69 wrote: post #106

This is the only sensible (but temporary) decision that the FAA could have done. The next step is to research reliable methods of navigation and air traffic rules for unmanned and autonomous aerial vehicles, and when that can be made demonstrably safe, this regulation can be revisited. If FAA would have allowed commercial drone operations without further regulation, and the technology would have had widespread adopti…

I think the ban should stay regardless of safety. One big issue here is noise and visual pollution.

This is a valid concern but it needs to be balanced against the existing noise, visual and chemical pollution caused by shopping trips in cars and delivery trucks.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#118

Post by mantraxD »

exDM69 wrote: post #115
sfk wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the ban should stay regardless of safety. One big issue here is noise and visual pollution.

I appreciate your opinion and recognize that there are many people who share your opinion but I can't agree. Compared to road and air traffic, it would take a serious amount of drones to match the noise and visual pollution. The pizza delivery man with his car or scooter makes more noise and takes more space than a drone would. And you have to remember that the early jet aircraft were very noisy and inefficient compa…

If machines are flying over your head, would you feel safe going out without a helmet on your head?

Despite all safety measures, you know it'll happen at some point. One of those will fail, its safety will fail and it'll drop on the head of some kid and put it in the hospital.

I can predict immediately that birds and drones colliding will be one of the biggest problems (and it's not something you can fix with frequent tech checkups, as it's not a technical failure, just a fact of life).

Having casualties is the case with cars too, of course, but it's a whole new kind of terror to expect not just cars hitting you coming from the street, but also machines dropping from the sky (where you usually aren't even looking).

I'd take one of those risks, but not both at the same time. I can't look for both at the same time. And I'm not saying "ban them" is the only solution, but this has to be solved somehow.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#119

Post by hereonbusiness »

drawkbox wrote: post #83

I'd like the US to be the innovators on drone deliveries but it looks like we'll pass that opportunity up. Maybe we can outlaw any form of driverless car as well. Just as both are getting to be new markets that could increase economic growth. Drones, if they are more efficient than truck deliveries from a cost and energy use perspective, for most things they will be the solution used. It is just does the US want that…

Driverless cars/vehicles are a whole different animal if you ask me. Personal and cargo transportation could be a lot more efficient (especially considering energy/resource efficiency) if you took the human element out of it.

Using flying drones for delivery is much more limited in scope when I think about it, you can't really haul loads with drones, each delivery has to be done more or less individually, I can't imagine that being more energy efficient than for example a driverless truck dropping off packages at designated pickup points in local communities.

Re: FAA bans the use of drones to deliver packages

#120

Post by sophacles »

hereonbusiness wrote: post #101

I don't see what problem delivering packages with drones would be solving, package delivery seems already quite efficient to me. Also I suppose drones would often be able to deliver just one package at a time because of weight restrictions. I pick up most of my packages at the local post office because I live in an apartment, it's a 5 minute walk away, not really an inconvenience.

So as I read this comment at my favorite coffee place, a UPS truck is blocking 2 parking spaces. It's been parked there about 5 minutes, and several cars stopped, thinking it was leaving soon, messing up traffic on the road before driving away because it was taking too long. That's lost business and serious inconvenience for other people. As I type this the guy has left, but the package he took in was small enough for a drone to deliver.

Now a different truck has pulled up and double parked across the road, with the driver taking a document tube into the office building across the street.

I wish this example was contrived, but I just watched it happen.

Several drivers were inconvenienced (an ongoing situation at the moment, and I've had to listen to the sound of the idling engines, which are definitely louder than the cars passing by. Drones on the other hand would have zipped in and out, without disrupting the traffic or making me listen to idling truck engines for several minutes in a row.

It's not only about just-in-time delivery for ME, it also reduces a bunch of secondary hassles.

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