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What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

thewinnower.com

131–140 of 195 posts

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#131

Whenever I mention my skepticism of the peer review mechanism, someone is always quick to claim how important and special it is, and that I should have faith in it. Here, they reject a paper and refuse even to peer review it. They refuse to explain why they feel it unacceptable. It comes from a scientist who has already published, and in the relevant fields. If they'll do this because of the slight risk of someone ma…

"They refuse to explain why they feel it unacceptable."

I read the paper. It's unacceptable because it's LITERALLY a "here are some things we Googled, and there weren't any time travelers" with a bibliography attached: there's no detailed explanation of experimental procedure, no detailed data. It's roughly equivalent to sending a middle-school book report to a literary journal.

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#132
I went to a conference* in 1994 in which Kip Thorne gave a talk on time travel. He made an offhand comment about evidence that backwards time-travel does not occur that was along similar lines. 2 points: 1) Not inconsistent for 'real' physicists to think about these issues. 2) I don't think this work is as novel in concept as the author thinks.

* Was for Carl Sagan's 60th birthday... was intended for serious audience of big time scientists but was intended to entertain.

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#133

I think the methodology of the paper is flawed. Why would a time traveller from the future be discussing "Comet ISON" or "Pope Francis"? According to Wikipedia, comet ISON wasn't ever bright enough to spot with the naked eye, and thus left no significant impact on humanity. It's obviously too early to decide if Pope Francis will leave a deep, significant impact, but odds are against it. For this methodology to really…

> I think the methodology of the paper is flawed. Why would a time traveller from the future be discussing "Comet ISON" or "Pope Francis"? According to Wikipedia, comet ISON wasn't ever bright enough to spot with the naked eye, and thus left no significant impact on humanity. It's obviously too early to decide if Pope Francis will leave a deep, significant impact, but odds are against it.

The problem is that they needed something to search for where we have a clear, well defined horizon before which people were extremely unlikely to mention the name at all.

Both of these meet the criteria because the names are now all over the historical record, but the names were new. In the case of Pope Francis, he was not only the first Pope Francis, but also the first pope in a millennium to pick an entirely new name (John Paul I was the first John Paul, but both John and Paul separately have a long history).

You are right that it might mean that they would miss time travellers. Who knows: If time travelling exists, all travellers might even be warned about this specific experiment.

But they in any case could not prove that we have not been visited by time travellers - all they could do was to pick terms that if they found them would give a strong indication that something odd was afoot.

They were also limited in that they were explicitly looking for something that could be researched cheaply, and by looking at the internet, and so an example like Hitler would not work.

> Identify "black swan" events (dot com crash, 2007 financial crash), and look at people who slowly offloaded their assets prior to it. Identify "underdogs" that became huge (eg. Apple in the 90s) and look at people who slowly brought into it during that period.

The problem is that you will likely find lots of people. People have all kinds of different reasons for investing, many of which leads to looking prescient after the fact.

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#134
post #88
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The fusion triple product has improved exponentially, and is 10,000 times better now than it was in 1970. It's a hard problem, but it's not so much "we keep trying and failing" as "we're consistently improving, but the bar is really high." It's as if computers were useless until we had a 6th-generation Core i7, and people were saying "bah, computers, haven't succeeded so far." We're not there yet, but we're getting p…

Again, I just can't help but think you've been blinded by SCIENCE! What I see is a curve that is slowing, not speeding, and no particular reason to believe that the curve ever gets over the "commercially-viable fusion" break-even point, ever. We are not obligated to stop thinking about things because of how awesome the alternate reality where this all works like gangbusters would be. This is science, not politics. Or…

I agree that we should support alternate approaches. I actually got that 10,000x number from a TED talk by the CEO of General Fusion.

Other worthy projects: Sandia's MagLIF, MIT's levitated dipole and the Alcator C-Mod, UW's spheromak and FRC, polywell, focus fusion, fast laser, Helion, Tri-Alpha, and probably more that I'm forgetting.

If you want a cheap fusion experiment, the ultimate is focus fusion, which needs a million bucks to finish their breakeven attempt. They've spent $3 million so far, and right now have an indiegogo campaign to raise $200K for a new reactor part made of beryllium.

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#135
post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see nothing wrong with publishing ordinary evidence for extraordinary things. I mean, I still wouldn't beleieve the extraordinary thing, but it could still be useful.

How about the hit to reputation? Many would level the criticism that publication was too early.

That's a problem that needs to be fixed.

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#136
post #7

Perhaps no evidence was found because people from the future have seen this paper and therefore know not to reveal themselves this way!

If there are time travellers from a future, it isn't our future, and this isn't their past - otherwise causality doesn't work. Instead if you travel back in time you travel to a point, which immediately bifurcates into a new reality. I like to think that we're all time travellers, collectively collapsing the universe's wavefunction through will alone... And now I'm onto determinism so I'll shut up.

[deleted]

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#137
post #67
post #50

The biggest issue that I see with publishing this work in a physics journal is that although time travel is certainly a concept in physics, the research involved here is not physics research. I'd describe it as sociological(?) research intended to shed light on a problem of interest to physics. That may seem like splitting hairs, but there's a real question of competence here: as a physicist, I don't feel especially…

The author isn't the first person to think of this, most notably Steven Hawking tried something similar http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/07/02/stephen-hawking-t...

I think the main difference is that this paper outlines a method to possibly find time travelers that weren't necessarily intending to publicize their existence, while Hawking's method presupposed that the time travelers

a) Had access to that specific time

b) could get to his specific location

c) did not mind it being known they were time travelers

d) viewed his party was worthy of their attention.

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#138
post #79
post #50

The biggest issue that I see with publishing this work in a physics journal is that although time travel is certainly a concept in physics, the research involved here is not physics research. I'd describe it as sociological(?) research intended to shed light on a problem of interest to physics. That may seem like splitting hairs, but there's a real question of competence here: as a physicist, I don't feel especially…

I agree. His attempts to get his type of paper being published in established physics journals are sort of explained in his last paragraph though. He thinks that there's "room in the world of publishing for science motivated primarily BY public interest, instead of IN THE public interest". Certainly there's no reason why such a journal to exist--free speech and all. I'm not a physicist, but certainly saying that such…

Can't edit, so correction: "...no reason why such a journal should not exist..."

Re: What Happened When We Tried to Publish a Real Paper Investigating Time Travel

#139
post #7

Perhaps no evidence was found because people from the future have seen this paper and therefore know not to reveal themselves this way!

If there are time travellers from a future, it isn't our future, and this isn't their past - otherwise causality doesn't work. Instead if you travel back in time you travel to a point, which immediately bifurcates into a new reality. I like to think that we're all time travellers, collectively collapsing the universe's wavefunction through will alone... And now I'm onto determinism so I'll shut up.

Novikov's self-consistency principle implies that we can change the past as long as we don't know it's been changed. (Well, maybe more accurately, the time traveller has "always" done whatever it was he did in the past.) So even if causality is a requirement, it isn't necessarily violated.

Likewise, lots of time travel in fiction actually has the hidden assumption of a second time dimension. If a second time dimension existed, causality could be maintained along that dimension while seemingly broken in the time dimension we know and love.

And there's always the possibility that causality isn't a given and is simply how we experience the universe. Just because it has always been observed and it makes intuitive sense doesn't mean it is always true. :)

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