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Startup advice: cold recruiting

stripe.com

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Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#101

Post by danbmil99 »

SilasX wrote: post #41
Jemaclus wrote: post #28

> Always have the ping come from a non-recruiter. I got an email a few days ago from the CEO of a startup in SF. In the email, he followed all of the rules in this email, including trying to get face-to-face chat by offering to get coffee. I'm not really looking for a job but I am open to new opportunities, so I replied and agreed to get coffee. The response comes from a recruiter. What? The CEO sends me an email and…

Interesting! This may explain what happened to me recently. I got an recruitment email that looked to be from the CTO of a startup. From their site, it appeared to be a ~50-150-person operation, so not a case of "everyone does everything". I was planning to respond something like, "Whoa, you're the CTO and you're recruiting people yourself? That's pretty hardcore!" (Or something less goofy, I don't know.) I didn't, b…

It could have been me. We're a 10-person startup with initial traction, but our site makes it look like a 50-person startup with extended traction.

This cold recruiting shit is hard. There's a really amazing opportunity here that I can't seem to sell. Guess that's why I'm the CTO, not the CEO.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#102

Post by borski »

gedrap wrote: post #92
EvanMiller wrote: post #40

I occasionally receive emails like these, and I agree with most of this advice. I will add a couple of personal turn-offs: * Overtesting. I have received multiple emails from different people at the same company with the exact same subject line ("Hey Evan, let's chat"). I am sure this subject works better than the other ones that they tried, but a little variation would make me feel like I am more than a conversion g…

>>> Don't be bashful, just say your company is hiring. While I haven't received this (yet), I strongly agree. Everyone knows a guy who messages you after years of not being in touch, asking how are you doing and all that crap while we both know he doesn't care and it's just a foreplay before asking for some favour. I won't say yes just because of that, so let's stop wasting time and looking silly.

You are possibly being overly cynical here.

It is completely plausible that the person both cares (genuinely) about how you have been the past few years, AND is hiring and thinks you'd be a great fit. These are not mutually exclusive. Not all founders are completely self-serving.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#103

Post by raving-richard »

jcurbo wrote: post #33

I was just on the receiving end of one of these, but it didn't quite work the same way. The email started out mentioning posts of mine on HN (met the first criteria, proof-of-work) and how their company was using that technology, which was effective and hooked me into reading the email and not immediately deleting it; but then went into a paragraph describing their company (didn't meet the second, describing what you…

I would be replying to the first email you mention, with something along the lines of: "Sure, I'd love to help you! My rates are $x per hour, and I currently have $y hours free in the next week you can buy if you're still interested."

Or something along those lines. Don't work for for-profit companies for free (and for not-for-profits, look at how much the top people are getting paid).

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#104

Post by raving-richard »

fecak wrote: post #49

From a job seeker approach, I'd think the 'opposite' of this is also effective (and what I'd suggest). Particularly the proof of work inclusion, which shows employers and hiring managers that you took some care in the contact. If someone emailed gdb and included much of this same information, I'd hope that they'd likely get an interview. Hey gdb, I just read your blog post about Open Source Retreat and love how Strip…

I'm in the job market right now, but being in a country other than the one I'm looking for a job in, it means that I can't do what you suggest.

But, this is something I really want to do. I wouldn't go in asking for a job, but just a "I want to know what you do and how you do it (and what sort of jobs exist at your place)". I suspect it's great for networking as well, if they do have a job come up, they might think of me...

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#105

Post by fecak »

raving-richard wrote: post #104
fecak wrote: post #49

From a job seeker approach, I'd think the 'opposite' of this is also effective (and what I'd suggest). Particularly the proof of work inclusion, which shows employers and hiring managers that you took some care in the contact. If someone emailed gdb and included much of this same information, I'd hope that they'd likely get an interview. Hey gdb, I just read your blog post about Open Source Retreat and love how Strip…

I'm in the job market right now, but being in a country other than the one I'm looking for a job in, it means that I can't do what you suggest. But, this is something I really want to do. I wouldn't go in asking for a job, but just a "I want to know what you do and how you do it (and what sort of jobs exist at your place)". I suspect it's great for networking as well, if they do have a job come up, they might think o…

The only part that you can't do is the cup of coffee. That doesn't mean you can't start a dialogue. Many people got their jobs through this kind of initial contact and some common interest, often in an open source project.

The best approach, as you mention, probably doesn't include asking for a job right away. Build some interest first.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#106

Post by Akujin »

There's pretty much no chance I'm gonna go out of my way to meet you in my spare time for coffee when I don't even know the minimum salary for this potential position unless I'm actually actively looking for a job.

If you're gonna be fishing for developers you need better bait than that.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#107

Post by silverbax88 »

gdb wrote: post #98
silverbax88 wrote: post #60

I love Stripe. Huge fan. But if I get an email from someone, anyone, at a company who wants to 'grab lunch' and talk about me working for company XYZ, I'll pass. I mean, he says this is what has been the most effective for them, so I can't argue that point. But the reality is I personally wouldn't ever take anyone up on this. Actually, now that I think about it, I would probably only respond if it was an email actual…

Thanks for the kind words! I'm not sure I fully follow your comment — what's the distinction you're drawing between managers/execs wanting to talk about their team, and someone wanting to talk about working at the company? Is it the specificity of them wanting you for their particular team?

Because who you specifically work for matters the most. And getting contacted by another dev just reeks of them being put up to it by the company.

I don't want to work for a company that makes it's developers go out and have lunch as a headhunter. I know I wouldn't want to have to reach out to people I didn't know and 'have lunch' with them just to see if they would be good people to work with.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#108

Post by SilasX »

danbmil99 wrote: post #101
SilasX wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting! This may explain what happened to me recently. I got an recruitment email that looked to be from the CTO of a startup. From their site, it appeared to be a ~50-150-person operation, so not a case of "everyone does everything". I was planning to respond something like, "Whoa, you're the CTO and you're recruiting people yourself? That's pretty hardcore!" (Or something less goofy, I don't know.) I didn't, b…

It could have been me. We're a 10-person startup with initial traction, but our site makes it look like a 50-person startup with extended traction. This cold recruiting shit is hard. There's a really amazing opportunity here that I can't seem to sell. Guess that's why I'm the CTO, not the CEO.

Well, do you recognize my email address as bein one you contacted? You don't have a profile here, and your username looks unrelated to the person who contacted me.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#109

Post by bmm6o »

x0x0 wrote: post #62
Ologn wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> YOU contacted me, not the other way around. You have the burden of proof of attracting me to your company. You should be the one jumping through hoops, not me. Yes. I get contacted by a headhunter that says they know of a company looking for engineers. I go on an interview and someone at the company asks me very officiously, "Why do you want to work for this company?" I respond, "I don't know that I do want to work…

That's happened to me too. My response is "I don't" and then I shut up. To overgeneralize, though not by much, SF startups suck ass at recruiting; the standard assumption is the whole world is chomping at the bit to work there, and it's a privilege to do so. (Though I do wonder how they get that worldview to comport with endless bitching about the lack of engineers.) And you hit the nail on the head with the lack of…

I understand that it has to be a good fit both ways and both parties have to sell themselves to the other, but "I don't" implies you're wasting everyone's time. Even "I don't, yet" is 100x better, and that's still a really lame response. If you want to be pitched to, just say so.

Re: Startup advice: cold recruiting

#110

Post by danbmil99 »

SilasX wrote: post #108
danbmil99 wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It could have been me. We're a 10-person startup with initial traction, but our site makes it look like a 50-person startup with extended traction. This cold recruiting shit is hard. There's a really amazing opportunity here that I can't seem to sell. Guess that's why I'm the CTO, not the CEO.

Well, do you recognize my email address as bein one you contacted? You don't have a profile here, and your username looks unrelated to the person who contacted me.

I was using indeed.com, it doesn't seem to be possible to review the emails I sent.

If you are interested in a serious, post-seed, pre-A startup opportunity please contact me at dan.miller at orgstars.com

And if that doesn't work, we can still discuss the (intellectually dishonest) libertarian arguments against the carbon tax. I actually care about stuff like that.

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