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Suicidal Software Developer

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Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#201

Post by dllthomas »

gobots wrote: post #167
saraid216 wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Ah, I understand what you are saying. No, I don't think you do. > The problem is that, I truly don't believe in gods or spirits anymore. Neither do I. I don't see how that's relevant to learning the subject matter that you're claiming to learn. You don't read a book about Java and say that you now understand Haskell. You don't read a book about real-time embedded systems and come away with an understanding of CSS.…

God is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything and the God Delusion are books about religion. I mentioned a few authors that I have read whose books cover either science, religion or a mixture of the two. I will grant you that I am not making a hard study into comparative religion and certainly did not mean to imply otherwise.

Incidentally, despite being somewhat sympathetic to the viewpoint, I felt The God Delusion paled in comparison to Dawkins' other works. He's far more compelling in the mode of "Isn't all this stuff amazing?" than the mode of "Isn't that stuff awful?"

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#202

Post by nomedeplume »

etjossem wrote: post #162
nomedeplume wrote: post #111

For a heterosexual man, a woman can't be your identity. Most heterosexual women need a partner with their own identity, one that she can merge with (she may temporarily settle for a partner who functions with her as their identity, but then she'll be unhappy, leave, cheat, or fantasize about cheating, or just be using the partner for other reasons). This is tough advice to swallow especially if your woman is your ide…

> "For a heterosexual man, a woman can't be your identity." > "Most heterosexual women need a partner with their own identity, one that she can merge with." Read those back and forth until you see the double standard. We can argue all day about whether it's healthy to depend on a partner to complete your identity. But you don't get to speak for what "most heterosexual women need," especially if you're a guy. None of…

"We are in the real world and what we say matters". That was the logic that ousted Larry Summers from Harvard. There is a double standard. Men and women have different brains and different emotional needs. Lesbian brains can be more similar to mens'.

And how dare the castrated men like you allow the feminist coalition to suffer any setback driven by logical argument. Good on you.

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#203

Post by gobots »

igravious wrote: post #180
gobots wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The internet and some really shitty people that I worked with a while back saved me. Here's a bit of backstory. I believed 100% that I would never get old or die because Armageddon would come before then, the Earth would be restored to a paradise and sickness / death would be wiped out for good. I started preaching from door to door at age 5 and was baptized at age 11. My parents have been in since 8 years old, and t…

Truly remarkable. I take it you saw the recent New York Times article about belief formation. It stated exactly what you say here, that direct attacks just strengthen a person's ideologies. It sounds like you must have worked very hard to avoid self-knowledge. That's so sad. I'm really really happy for where you are now though. I've had countless conversations with religious fundamentalists that end in them asking me…

I missed the article but it sounds interesting, please link it if you have it.

You are correct only to a point when it comes to self-knowledge. I am horrified that I was never allowed to learn about evolution and science in general, though I've done my best to catch up (started with the cosmos series from the 70s, just finished The Grand Design for the second time and am currently reading Cosmos and the Greatest Show on Earth).

I suspect the idea of the sacred and profane is a vestigial part of most human's brains.

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#204

Post by gobots »

DanBC wrote: post #199
gobots wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there is a misconception in this thread that I am arguing against the study of religion, but I'm not. I understand the value in comparative religion classes in terms of enriching one's understanding of history and human culture. I personally have no use for this in my current course. I am interested in the harmful aspects of religion.

You said that you are learning about religion. People thought you were learning about religion. Those people would have understood your point if you had said that you are learning about atheism.

Once again, I have to point out I am an atheist, I'm not learning about atheism. Science != atheism. Reading about the evils of religion != learning atheism.

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#205

Post by [deleted] »

mrec wrote: post #184
mrcwinn wrote: post #63

Hey there, if you're listening! I actually dealt with something similar almost a decade ago. I never considered suicide, but during a snowy winter where I also experienced financial pressure and a lot of family strain and changes, I very slowly slipped into a sort of "fog." I also became very sensitive, both to how people interacted with me, but even to physical things. I remember bumping my shoulder into a door one…

> Life is short and it is amazing. I'm sure you mean well. But if there's a more efficient way to alienate someone than presenting the direct opposite of their experience as if it were some great objective Truth, I can't imagine what it is.

[deleted]

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#206

Post by gobots »

dllthomas wrote: post #201
gobots wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything and the God Delusion are books about religion. I mentioned a few authors that I have read whose books cover either science, religion or a mixture of the two. I will grant you that I am not making a hard study into comparative religion and certainly did not mean to imply otherwise.

Incidentally, despite being somewhat sympathetic to the viewpoint, I felt The God Delusion paled in comparison to Dawkins' other works. He's far more compelling in the mode of "Isn't all this stuff amazing?" than the mode of "Isn't that stuff awful?"

Currently reading The Greatest Show on Earth and I have to agree, but I do agree with many of the points that were made in The God Delusion. I will say he should have spent less time on his memeology ideas.

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#207

Post by gobots »

mreiland wrote: post #186
gobots wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

God is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything and the God Delusion are books about religion. I mentioned a few authors that I have read whose books cover either science, religion or a mixture of the two. I will grant you that I am not making a hard study into comparative religion and certainly did not mean to imply otherwise.

You're missing Saraid's point.

Indeed – or more to the point: I wasn't clear in my original statement. I am learning about certain aspects of religion – not learning comparative religion.

I am not however "learning atheism" as others have decided to claim in this thread. I stopped believing in god years ago, at that point by definition I was an atheist.

I am interested in the origins of religion, the scientific reasons that it exists, and the negative impact it has on people.

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#208

Post by etjossem »

nomedeplume wrote: post #202
etjossem wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "For a heterosexual man, a woman can't be your identity." > "Most heterosexual women need a partner with their own identity, one that she can merge with." Read those back and forth until you see the double standard. We can argue all day about whether it's healthy to depend on a partner to complete your identity. But you don't get to speak for what "most heterosexual women need," especially if you're a guy. None of…

"We are in the real world and what we say matters". That was the logic that ousted Larry Summers from Harvard. There is a double standard. Men and women have different brains and different emotional needs. Lesbian brains can be more similar to mens'. And how dare the castrated men like you allow the feminist coalition to suffer any setback driven by logical argument. Good on you.

Take a look at what you wrote. You're not attempting to explain a difference in the standard deviation of male and female test scores - backed by data - in an exercise of positive scholarship. Putting aside the hilariously sexist conclusions other people drew from that data, you are not Larry Summers.

All you're doing is giving normative advice about what men and women's identities should look like. You're claiming that women will always be unhappy with partners whose identities depend on their partner, and you're also saying that it's unacceptable for men to do that. There are no logical arguments being made here. It's pure misogyny.

And maybe I'm the only one in this thread who has the balls to call you out. Newsflash: men can think women are people too. Now go read about the http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bechdel_test - it's fascinating.

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#209

Post by dllthomas »

gobots wrote: post #206
dllthomas wrote: post #201

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Incidentally, despite being somewhat sympathetic to the viewpoint, I felt The God Delusion paled in comparison to Dawkins' other works. He's far more compelling in the mode of "Isn't all this stuff amazing?" than the mode of "Isn't that stuff awful?"

Currently reading The Greatest Show on Earth and I have to agree, but I do agree with many of the points that were made in The God Delusion. I will say he should have spent less time on his memeology ideas.

Yeah, I should say that I don't mean to imply that this has any bearing on whether he is correct or incorrect, in either case!

Re: Suicidal Software Developer

#210

Post by dbbolton »

moron4hire wrote: post #50
dbbolton wrote: post #19

I remember reading a quote somewhere attributed to a person who survived jumping off the Golden Gate Bridge. Paraphrased, they said that at the moment they jumped, they suddenly realized that every single problem in their life was fixable except the fact that they had just jumped off a f *ing bridge.

Adrenaline can do that to you. Unfortunately, it passes. I try very hard to not make big, life-changing decisions when I'm happy and energetic, because it's usually jumping (if you'll excuse the pun) feet first into commitments that I'm not going to be able to keep when I go back to normal, level attitude--or even worse--my low periods, when failing at my commitments is not only a foregone conclusion, but I know it,…

I actually recall reading somewhere that a good many of the survivors had a complete recovery and no longer suffered from depression (I think it may have been in a discussion about the documentary mentioned below), but I can't find any hard data on the matter.
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