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For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

usmarshals.gov

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Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#271

Post by gambiting »

easytiger wrote: post #266
badfortrains wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Civil forfeiture. From wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civil_forfeiture#United_States "In civil cases, the owner need not be judged guilty of any crime; it is possible for the Government to prevail by proving that someone other than the owner used the property to commit a crime. In contrast, criminal forfeiture is usually carried out in a sentence following a conviction and is a punitive act against the offen…

How is that reasonable?

It's not. But it's not like the US Justice system is not known for its acting grossly out of proportion.

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#272

Post by dalore »

artursapek wrote: post #45

The price has tanked today as a result of this. http://cryptowat.ch/btce/btcusd/1hr/ Market started going crazy earlier today when DPR's seized coins started to move. https://blockchain.info/address/1FfmbHfnpaZjKFvyi1okTjJJusN4... The downtrend is only accelerating.

But if you read the link, they aren't selling DPR coins, but the ones seized from SR

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#273

Post by Confusion »

sbierwagen wrote: post #53
viraptor wrote: post #36

Could someone explain the logic behind the price drop? Is that related to the fact that those 30k will be sold below the standard price? For some reason it seems counter-intuitive for me, since the money connected to those coins have been already paid once (whether for mining them or via exchange). So in practice it's more like they've been actually paid for ~twice now, so the effect "should" be opposite.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand Increasing supply always reduces the market price.

Only when increased supply doesn't cause an even higher increase in demand. There are some examples of this in history, although they are few and far between.

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#274

Post by dalore »

knz42 wrote: post #177
Ologn wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> no conception of how to value the underlying asset They have no conception of how to value the underlying asset because the underlying asset has absolutely no value. Bitcoin is one of the purest scams that has ever been conceived. Even subprime real estate, pets.com stock, dutch Tulip Bulbs etc. had some value. You're buying and selling a hash - a number. It's absolutely worthless. That people are being suckered in…

In all fairness, the paper on which $100 bills are printed is quite worthless as well. I think ever since people have stopped using gold and silver bullion (after arrowheads and knives) as currency items, there has been this consensus that money has the value that people give to it, not the value of its material (or, in BTC's case, immaterial) representations.

Isn't money made out of special counterfeit-proof paper? Making that paper valuable since you could use it to make money?

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#275

Post by tlrobinson »

drcode wrote: post #232
saganus wrote: post #6

Anyone care to take a guess as to how will this affect Bitcoin price?

I think this is the best publicity imaginable. I can't see any reason why the price wouldn't go through the roof over the next month, but bitcoin prices are tough to predict.

Can you explain why?

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#277

Post by fancyketchup »

PeterisP wrote: post #152
dnautics wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but market fluctuations always shoot above and below 'rationalizable valuations'. A few reasons why your analogy is flawed. First, M0 (which is one of the more conservative definition of money, is about 4 trillion, so the value loss from a billion dollars is not going to be anywhere near 10% to start off with). Secondly, by printing money you're again only affecting M0, but there are a lot of debt-based instrume…

My analogy doesn't seem flawed to me- that's exactly what I meant: 1. printing a billion dollars should be approximately just as [in]significant to USD supply as the 30k BTC to the BTC supply in circulation; that's why I said a billion, but not a million or a trillion; 2. market fluctions over/undershooting any corrections is reasonable, but not exaggerating them by multiple orders of magnitude - it may react to a 0.…

Well, the sort of obvious explanation is that amount of BTC in active circulation is much smaller than bitcoin proponents claim.

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#278

Post by baq »

sschueller wrote: post #270
marme wrote: post #257

What people should be more concerned with is the fact that the government is selling off someone elses property before they have even been convicted of a crime. Dread pirate roberts plead not guilty and has still not had a trial yet. He has not been convicted of any crime so if these are his coins they are selling them before the trial is even finished

These coins should be removed from the blockchain in a protocol update agreed upon by everyone. No government should be making money this way.

so it's perfectly fair to profit from selling drugs that kill people, but when the profits from illegal activity are seized, the public shouldn't be able to reuse them?

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#279

Post by scrollaway »

sschueller wrote: post #270
marme wrote: post #257

What people should be more concerned with is the fact that the government is selling off someone elses property before they have even been convicted of a crime. Dread pirate roberts plead not guilty and has still not had a trial yet. He has not been convicted of any crime so if these are his coins they are selling them before the trial is even finished

These coins should be removed from the blockchain in a protocol update agreed upon by everyone. No government should be making money this way.

Brilliant precendent you're trying to set here Einstein.

Re: For Sale: 29,656.51306529 Bitcoins

#280

Post by spindritf »

marme wrote: post #257

What people should be more concerned with is the fact that the government is selling off someone elses property before they have even been convicted of a crime. Dread pirate roberts plead not guilty and has still not had a trial yet. He has not been convicted of any crime so if these are his coins they are selling them before the trial is even finished

I don't think it is in this case.

Bitcoin is pretty fungible, almost like cash. If it turns out that he's innocent, he can sue the government for the money. It's not like they're selling some unique piece of art, or his family seat.

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