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Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

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Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#31
I think most people misunderstand the intent of Turing's paper in which he describes his eponymous test. I agree with Chomsky's reading, which he laid out in "Language & Thought":

"There is a great deal of often heated debate about these matters in the literature of the cognitive sciences, artificial intelligence, and philosophy of mind, but it is hard to see that any serious question has been posed. The question of whether a computer is playing chess, or doing long division, or translating Chinese, is like the question of whether robots can murder or airplanes can fly -- or people; after all, the "flight" of the Olympic long jump champion is only an order of magnitude short of that of the chicken champion (so I'm told). These are questions of decision, not fact; decision as to whether to adopt a certain metaphoric extension of common usage.

There is no answer to the question whether airplanes really fly (though perhaps not space shuttles). Fooling people into mistaking a submarine for a whale doesn't show that submarines really swim; nor does it fail to establish the fact. There is no fact, no meaningful question to be answered, as all agree, in this case. The same is true of computer programs, as Turing took pains to make clear in the 1950 paper that is regularly invoked in these discussions. Here he pointed out that the question whether machines think "may be too meaningless to deserve discussion," being a question of decision, not fact, though he speculated that in 50 years, usage may have "altered so much that one will be able to speak of machines thinking without expecting to be contradicted" -- as in the case of airplanes flying (in English, at least), but not submarines swimming. Such alteration of usage amounts to the replacement of one lexical item by another one with somewhat different properties. There is no empirical question as to whether this is the right or wrong decision.

In this regard, there has been serious regression since the first cognitive revolution, in my opinion. Superficially, reliance on the Turing test is reminiscent of the Cartesian approach to the existence of other minds. But the comparison is misleading. The Cartesian experiments were something like a litmus test for acidity: they sought to determine whether an object has a certain property, in this case, possession of mind, one aspect of the world. But that is not true of the artificial intelligence debate.

Another superficial similarity is the interest in simulation of behavior, again only apparent, I think. As I mentioned earlier, the first cognitive revolution was stimulated by the achievements of automata, much as today, and complex devices were constructed to simulate real objects and their functioning: the digestion of a duck, a flying bird, and so on. But the purpose was not to determine whether machines can digest or fly. Jacques de Vaucanson, the great artificer of the period, was concerned to understand the animate systems he was modeling; he constructed mechanical devices in order to formulate and validate theories of his animate models, not to satisfy some performance criterion."

http://www.chomsky.info/books/prospects01.htm

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#32
Turing test and all it's connotative baggage aside, the first chatbot that will impress me is the one where I can't for the life of me figure out how it's creating the responses it is.

"Eugene", I can imagine creating when I was 12.

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#34
The chatbot Eugene Goostman did not pass Ray Kurzweil's version of the Turing Test. It passed the Turing Test as set up by the organizers.

Turing never even mentioned the criteria that participants should be aware that they are possibly talking to a computer. This single criteria should not matter for intelligence IMO, because the whole point of the test was to abstract away the appearance. The other way around: a chatbot doesn't pass the test if a participant mistakes a human for a machine.

People fail the Turing Test all the time when unaware of chat scripts. Even some upvoted Hackernews comments may have been artificially generated without being detected as such.

The best way for me to detect if something is up, is to ask the chatbot about Alan Turing, 42 and the Turing Test. Then to curse at it. Most chatbot makers can't resist adding lines specifically for these questions, or they show feigned annoyance that is easy to pick up on. I got Goostman to admit that he was a Turing Test and then we talked about bots some more. Eugene ended with:

I call all these chatter-bots "chatter-nuts" due to their extremely high intelligence. I hope you recognize irony.

Full conversation here: http://pastebin.com/Wf4uiCRf

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#35

Kurzweil is right to be unimpressed. This chatbot is actually less impressive than Racter which dates back to the early 80s (and used similar and cleverer distraction tactics such as going off on tangents and basically being completely nuts).

I've had better bots nagging me to signup to cam sites on MSN/ICQ... Unimpressed is putting it lightly ;)

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#36

Kudos to Kurzweil for calling them out. That chatbot doesn't look especially sophisticated.

> I don't think you don't think that I don't think you don't need to change your opinions. Where do you came from, by the way? Could you tell me about the place where you live?

Actual quote from EG

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#37
post #2

I've had more believable conversations with CleverBot. It's hard to believe this hoax has gone as far as it has.

Cleverbot is all non-sequiturs. Nothing ever remotely makes sense.

It is possible to get it into a chain of counting though. Eg user says four, it says five, user says 6, it says seven, and that goes on for a while.

(edit:So that's not completely non sequitur things)

I don't think I've ever seen a chatbot on a web page that can do addition. (unless one counts wolfram|alpha: it does respond to greetings after all.)

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#38
post #3

This is a nicely written and clear explanation of why the announcement by the University of Reading is bullshit. In fact, it is was more than they deserve. Way more. I would suggest shunning them is the right response. The University of Reading is, of course, the august institution behind: http://blog.jgc.org/2010/05/inside-rfid-virus.html http://blog.jgc.org/2006/12/midas-number-or-why-divide-by-ze...

What does the term "august institution" mean. Can't find any good definitions on google.

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#39
post #3

This is a nicely written and clear explanation of why the announcement by the University of Reading is bullshit. In fact, it is was more than they deserve. Way more. I would suggest shunning them is the right response. The University of Reading is, of course, the august institution behind: http://blog.jgc.org/2010/05/inside-rfid-virus.html http://blog.jgc.org/2006/12/midas-number-or-why-divide-by-ze...

Good summary from the Register as well: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2014/06/10/world_to_captain_cyb...

Re: Response by Ray Kurzweil to chatbot Eugene Goostman “passing the Turing test”

#40
post #12

The whole thing sounded iffy to me from the first second I heard about it, despite the fact that most of the tech media was going ga-ga over it. I mean, the AI being only a teenage Hungarian boy (meaning the judges should've expected it to be "less intelligent than a normal native adult")...and only fooling 1/3 of the judges? That sounds like a whole lot of cheating to declare that it "passed" the Turing test.

Yeah after reading Ray's conversation with the bot, I was surprised that 30% of the judges were fooled. I guess maybe they were also 13 years old and had English as a second language.

I will explain this mystery to you: they simply did not ask any probing questions like that. This is also called the ELIZA effect

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ELIZA_effect

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