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No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

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Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#11

Post by IgorPartola »

mhurron wrote: post #8
IgorPartola wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is great news. This means IPv6 there is that much closer to being a reality.

Carrier-Grade NAT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier-grade_NAT As in what is (unfortunately) actually being used. ISP's have taken so long to even begin to look at moving to IPv6 that stopgaps like CGN have to be put in place. Then, of course, why break what is working so IPv6 is put off even further.

Agreed. Carrier-Grade NAT is the darkest timeline. However, I have not yet seen any ISP actually do this.

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#12

Post by darrelld »

bobwise wrote: post #9

What are the practical consumer-level implications of this? My understanding is that every internet-enabled device needs a unique IP address. If there are no more unique addresses, can no more devices connect to the internet in this region?

Excuse me if I'm being dense, but why does every internet enabled device need a unique IP? I thought the service providers had unique IPs and we just made our requests through them.

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#13

Post by nemothekid »

IgorPartola wrote: post #11
mhurron wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carrier-Grade NAT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier-grade_NAT As in what is (unfortunately) actually being used. ISP's have taken so long to even begin to look at moving to IPv6 that stopgaps like CGN have to be put in place. Then, of course, why break what is working so IPv6 is put off even further.

Agreed. Carrier-Grade NAT is the darkest timeline. However, I have not yet seen any ISP actually do this.

As IPv4 starts to run out, more routable, ipv6 will start to spring up (if Amazon runs out of ipv4 addresses, service X will be IPv6 only)

That may be the best forcing function in IPv6 adoption.

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#14

Post by wmf »

mhurron wrote: post #8
IgorPartola wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is great news. This means IPv6 there is that much closer to being a reality.

Carrier-Grade NAT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier-grade_NAT As in what is (unfortunately) actually being used. ISP's have taken so long to even begin to look at moving to IPv6 that stopgaps like CGN have to be put in place. Then, of course, why break what is working so IPv6 is put off even further.

CGN has a real cost. ISPs like T-Mobile and Time Warner have found that IPv6+CGN (either DS-Lite or 464) is cheaper than CGN alone because 50% of traffic can bypass the CGN.

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#15

Post by zokier »

IgorPartola wrote: post #7
rational-future wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"the worse the better" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikolay_Chernyshevsky

Sort of. IPv6 adoption is a matter of supply/demand economics. The supply of IPv4 is quickly approaching zero, while the demand is rising fast. At the same time the supply if IPv6 is effectively unlimited, but the demand is not there. At some point, the supply of IPv4 will go so low that its cost will suddenly jump. The cost of IPv6 deployment is still too high (mostly in human labor to set it up, and somewhat in equ…

> I think the next big step for ISP's is to provide IPv6-only native service to their clients, and add IPv6-to-IPv4 gateways to allow access to IPv4-only internet

Isn't that pretty much how DS-lite works?

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#16

Post by chrisBob »

I don't have a good feel for the numbers involved here. Things like this always report: "We are out!... only 4,000,000 or so addressed remaining!" Four million sounds like a lot to me. Some number of the IP addresses that are counted as gone are also still unused.

Can someone give me some idea of the situation with numbers that are easier to understand? Can we still limp through for a few years, or is this actually the crisis point?

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#17

Post by api »

mhurron wrote: post #8
IgorPartola wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is great news. This means IPv6 there is that much closer to being a reality.

Carrier-Grade NAT https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carrier-grade_NAT As in what is (unfortunately) actually being used. ISP's have taken so long to even begin to look at moving to IPv6 that stopgaps like CGN have to be put in place. Then, of course, why break what is working so IPv6 is put off even further.

Reminds me of fossil fuels and other sustainability issues...

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#18

Post by IgorPartola »

zokier wrote: post #15
IgorPartola wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sort of. IPv6 adoption is a matter of supply/demand economics. The supply of IPv4 is quickly approaching zero, while the demand is rising fast. At the same time the supply if IPv6 is effectively unlimited, but the demand is not there. At some point, the supply of IPv4 will go so low that its cost will suddenly jump. The cost of IPv6 deployment is still too high (mostly in human labor to set it up, and somewhat in equ…

> I think the next big step for ISP's is to provide IPv6-only native service to their clients, and add IPv6-to-IPv4 gateways to allow access to IPv4-only internet Isn't that pretty much how DS-lite works?

Sort of. DS-Lite involves a Carrier Grade NAT as well. Take a look at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPv6_transition_mechanisms for all the different possible mechanism devised so far.

Edit: for my money, NAT64 + DNS64 would get us 90% of the way there. OS support for pseudo-IPv4 would really fix this 100%: if the application wants to talk IPv4, the OS would transparently translate it into an IPv6 address in the 64:ff9b::/96 address prefix.

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#19

Post by zokier »

chrisBob wrote: post #16

I don't have a good feel for the numbers involved here. Things like this always report: "We are out!... only 4,000,000 or so addressed remaining!" Four million sounds like a lot to me. Some number of the IP addresses that are counted as gone are also still unused. Can someone give me some idea of the situation with numbers that are easier to understand? Can we still limp through for a few years, or is this actually t…

Well they give you another figure for scale:

> Since it began operating in 2002, the organization has assigned more than 182 million IPv4 addresses throughout Latin America and the Caribbean.

182 million addresses in 12 years is roughly 15 million addresses per year, or 1.25 million addresses per month. At that rate 4 million addresses would last maybe 3 months.

Re: No more IPv4 addresses in Latin America and the Caribbean

#20

Post by LeoPanthera »

boobsbr wrote: post #10
bobwise wrote: post #9

What are the practical consumer-level implications of this? My understanding is that every internet-enabled device needs a unique IP address. If there are no more unique addresses, can no more devices connect to the internet in this region?

ISPs could start putting users behind a giant NAT. One cable company used to do it in Brazil back in the 2000's

Most cellular providers do this already.
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