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Gittip, Year Two

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Re: Gittip, Year Two

#201

Post by pekk »

rhizome wrote: post #193
ta140604 wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we go on with your analogy, QA report would look as follows: "Your piece of shit program burned down the whole fucking server farm, you useless assclown! You belong in jail!", where the real bug was maybe a crash. That's not a good, or even acceptable QA report, I'd say. Look, if you think saying "men are rapists" is not a problem, there's not much to discuss here. Before that point I had my doubts - okay, they're…

Repeated errors have certainly received bug reports of a similar tone. In the context of QA I'd say that saying someone belongs in jail would be seen as humor and sarcasm, so that part doesn't really hold for me. That said, I really don't see any nuance or indication that you were an ally before someone said "men are rapists," tbh. "Men are rapists" is an extreme statement, but "hateful hypocrites" isn't. Gotcha. If…

Most QA reports do not end in "fuck you fuck you stop talking to me" for good reasons.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#202

Post by pekk »

matdes wrote: post #150
pekk wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, that wasn't a jab at feminism in tech! Feminism is great and there are some big problems to address in tech. But paying people to stir up heated conflicts and throw Tumblr-style tantrums isn't fixing anything, it is actually misrepresenting women in tech and doing harm to their cause.

http://www.derailingfordummies.com/derail-using-anger/ c.f. "You are hurting your cause by being angry" try to be less of a trope.

Women in tech certainly aren't a problem! Feminism isn't a problem. Pointing out problems isn't a problem. Affirmative action isn't a problem. Even being angry isn't a problem.

Another poster made a useful comparison to QA. One imagines an otherwise mild-mannered QA Engineer becoming righteously angry about a very scummy feature, or a software defect which threatens lives. But this QA Engineer has better and worse ways to channel that anger into buy-in for a fix. The anger in itself may be useful by leading to useful things, but it may also be harmful if it leads to harmful things. Anyone can understand this if they want to.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#203

Post by rhizome »

pekk wrote: post #201
rhizome wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Repeated errors have certainly received bug reports of a similar tone. In the context of QA I'd say that saying someone belongs in jail would be seen as humor and sarcasm, so that part doesn't really hold for me. That said, I really don't see any nuance or indication that you were an ally before someone said "men are rapists," tbh. "Men are rapists" is an extreme statement, but "hateful hypocrites" isn't. Gotcha. If…

Most QA reports do not end in "fuck you fuck you stop talking to me" for good reasons.

And that's why metaphors are leaky abstractions.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#204

Post by harrylyme »

ta140604 wrote: post #161
rhizome wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pointing out problems is actually a very important part of any solution. You don't lambaste QA people because they don't actually fix bugs.

Agreed. The problem is, they exaggerate and twist the truth, spread hate, unnecessarily antagonizing people, and actively push away those who try to reach out to them trying to do something.

Exactly: people like @shanley and @ashedryden make money by polarizing and then profiting from the resulting flames of their gender argument, and so vigorously resist even talking to those that they accuse and condemn. It's the type of narcissistic intolerance that is rarely seen in such pure form.

The logic here is rather straightforward: to a 'stage4' narcissist, their opinions are the functional equivalent of absolute truths, and therefore it is sacrilegious to even imply that they be 'open for debate'. So if anyone persists in challenging one of their sermons,that person is either grossly ignorant (solution => RTFM) OR is intentionally 'attacking' or 'harassing' (because there is no gray area to debate for the histrionically 'self-deified' -- it's impossible to debate across parallel 'Absolutes' -"God does not play dice";)

Heck, at this stage of ferment, she is all but accusing (the almost freakishly fair minded) Chad of misogyny :D

And it's worse for those without a monetary connection: https://twitter.com/shanley/status/474265272660942848

P.S. SK: a bit of advice: don't look a gift horse in the mouth (good wine and a menagerie of stuffed animals are not cheap in SF ;)

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#205

Post by aianus »

jacquesm wrote: post #50
aianus wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I moved to Canada from Romania as a child and I don't think it was much of a win. In exchange for more economic opportunity, I grew up with no family (other than mom and dad) which I think has stunted my personal growth a lot. Other people seem to care a lot about their families and getting married and having children but all of those things are really foreign to me. Actually I'm not even sure about the economic oppo…

Emigration is super tough, especially on kids. But growing up with just your mom and dad is actually not that rare. I have a super large family but almost 0 contact with them. What stops you from moving back to Romania?

I don't have any brothers or sisters either. I don't know, it seemed pretty rare to me while I was growing up.

Nothing's stopping me, really, except that I don't think I'd fit in anymore.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#206

Post by kmfrk »

whit537 wrote: post #139
kmfrk wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Surprisingly, I hear, by far, the most about gittip from feminist circles; it's easy to explain the reason for using gittip in that context. It's great that people use gittip for that, but I also think the barrier to understanding gittip is easier for people who support feminist causes than for most other demographics. I've tried using gittip as a single-donation tip jar for people who fixed or forked broken repos, b…

It's a design decision, not a tax/regulatory issue. We've had one-off tipjars for decades and they haven't changed the game. My mortgage is recurring so my income needs to be recurring as well. We currently have an "Other Ways to Give" on your profile where you can link a bitcoin address or Venmo account. That's an outlet for one-offs. We may mix in first-class one-offs eventually but we're not in a rush. See https:/…

I see. One consideration could be a more substantial floor for one-time donations can ensure that it conforms more to your vision of a sustainable donation model.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#207

Post by infruset »

eswat wrote: post #95
infruset wrote: post #33

I was really surprised to see they don't accept Bitcoin. I feel like it is the perfect use case and would probably help them gather some more enthusiasm from the community. However, one could also contend that Bitcoin might very well kill them..

We can do payouts in Bitcoin currently, but it’s a manual process. We have an Issue on GitHub to remedy this to make it automated while making sure we do it right. Any help would be appreciated: https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/1960

I was thinking more along the lines of having two different kinds of gifts, dollars and bitcoins, and when someone gives bitcoins to someone else, the receiver has to accept is as bitcoins by providing an address if they want to cash it out.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#208

Post by llamataboot »

iodfgj wrote: post #96

I think gittip had the potential to become something great and yea, sure, you've had a substantial increase in traffic since last year but an increase in traffic does not mean an increase in quality. I've been looking over at gittip for a while now and saw it was doing good things for good open source developers but your homepage shows the problem. The top 2 money recipients are 2 feminists which have never seen a li…

I think you're kind of insulting to everyone that finds the work of those two individuals valuable, those individuals themselves, feminists in tech, people that support more people working for social justice and inclusion in tech, and you hide behind a green name to make your snarky comment. /You/ are part of the problem in tech.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#209

Post by betamatt »

pekk wrote: post #197
betamatt wrote: post #178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, sure, whatever, who cares? Irrelevant to a conversation about who has a "right" to use the platform, and for what purposes.

Nobody is denying anyone the right to use the platform.

But you think they should. You said they should shut down rather than serve users you disagree with. That kind of thinking is toxic.

Re: Gittip, Year Two

#210

Post by lucisferre »

whit537 wrote: post #130
iodfgj wrote: post #96

I think gittip had the potential to become something great and yea, sure, you've had a substantial increase in traffic since last year but an increase in traffic does not mean an increase in quality. I've been looking over at gittip for a while now and saw it was doing good things for good open source developers but your homepage shows the problem. The top 2 money recipients are 2 feminists which have never seen a li…

Gittip is a site for multiple communities, not one single community, so I take it as a sign of strength that we do in fact have multiple communities using Gittip now. Think along the lines of PayPal or Twitter: they are a big tent. I've added a +1 for you to https://github.com/gittip/www.gittip.com/issues/1074 , because you're right that the homepage currently conflates the different communities that are using Gittip…

Don't feed the trolls.
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