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The day I left my son in the car

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Re: The day I left my son in the car

#41

Post by vvvv »

encoderer wrote: post #24

I once left my puppy beagle in the back of my car, windows cracked, while I ran into the restaurant to pick up takeout. I was not in there more than 5 mins. When I got out, started to pull away, and was stopped by a cop who then called animal services. This level of nanny-state-ism drives me slightly crazy. But the real issue for me was the person who decided s/he needed to call the police (the police for this). If i…

There is a public discussion in Poland right now on whether it's legal to break a window if you see a dog in a locked car.

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#42

Post by rsync »

As a sanity check, here is the law in California (which, I assume, is relatively restrictive, since it's California...):

It is illegal to leave a 6 years old or younger unattended in a motor vehicle when:

There are conditions that present a significant risk to the child's health or safety. Example: Leaving a child in a closed car on a very hot day.

The vehicle's engine is running, the keys are in the ignition, or both. Children can start or move the car causing injuries and/or deaths to themselves or others. An opportunist may (and many have) seize the moment to jump in and drive your car away, child still strapped in.[1]

So ... as long as there's nothing unsafe and the engine isn't running, you're "legal".

[1] http://www.dmv.org/ca-california/safety-laws.php

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#43

Post by mikestew »

The U. S. has long been a country of busy-bodies (the Puritans weren't known for keeping their noses out of the business of others), and the example of this story demonstrates that cellphone cameras make it easier to share your nosiness without that uncomfortable confrontation of the past.

Before you go off to pull out those "child cooks in car in Texas in July" anecdotes, consider that motor vehicle crashes are the leading cause of death for children. So if we're collectively that worried about it, let's get up in arms about needlessly taking the child on a car trip before we worry about applying "justice" to someone who left their child in a car in 50F weather.

If it were truly a case of "good samaritan" I'd blow it off. But I'm going to guess it was more a case of "she's doing something I think is awful. Regardless of whether harm was done or not, I'm going to go tattle!"

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#44

Post by IanDrake »

Seriously, this is my number one reason for not having kids.

For the younger crowd who may not understand, I was born in '77:

- I rode in the back hatch (no seats) of my dad's corvette until I was 8, cops would wave to us.

- At 6 I could ride my bike around pretty much anywhere I wanted, but wasn't allowed to cross rt6 (which I didn't, though no one checked).

- Left in the car in parking lots for up to an hour.

- Arrived home from school with no one home starting in 1st grade.

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#45

Post by anigbrowl »

baddox wrote: post #32
DanBC wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parent runs into store for few minutes, trips and knocks head becoming unconcious / has stroke / has heart attack / etc etc - child dies. Having said that, This story is a really good example of how tough it is for some parents and how hostile society is to parenting.

If the father became unconscious, had a stroke or a heart attack, etc. while driving or doing anything with the child away from other people, the child could die.

Yes, but people would know the child was there. If someone fall down unconscious in the middle of the supermarket nobody knows which car they arrived in, or even for sure that they arrived in a car, and nobody knows about the unattended child. That's a different kind of risk.

On the other hand, for the person in the parking lot to film the child in the car and call police, but not make any contact with the child or wait by the car, borders on malice. Police and prosecutors should investigate but heavily discount such pseudo-testimony because it is deliberately presented without context.

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#46

Post by claar »

I hope the reason that this story is popular is that we as a society agree it's absurd.

Leaving a child in a locked car in the situation described is perfectly acceptable. The police getting involved is ridiculous, which makes it a great story. Hopefully the correct lesson is learned.

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#48

Post by claar »

IanDrake wrote: post #44

Seriously, this is my number one reason for not having kids. For the younger crowd who may not understand, I was born in '77: - I rode in the back hatch (no seats) of my dad's corvette until I was 8, cops would wave to us. - At 6 I could ride my bike around pretty much anywhere I wanted, but wasn't allowed to cross rt6 (which I didn't, though no one checked). - Left in the car in parking lots for up to an hour. - Arr…

Yep, I can relate. I was born in '78 and grew up on a farm.

Please, have kids and raise them reasonably according to your own standards, not the nanny-state's. If we don't defend personal freedom, who will?

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#49

Post by steve-howard »

sadris wrote: post #12

Another example of why you should never talk to the cops. When they come to ask, "Did you or your wife leave your child in the car?" Only acceptable response is: come back with a warrant.

They already had evidence of the facts at hand, if not evidence of wrongdoing.

> a bystander had noticed me leaving my son in the car, had recorded the incident using a phone’s camera, and had then contacted the police.

Re: The day I left my son in the car

#50

Post by yason »

nkurz wrote: post #2

I'd be interested in hearing non-US perspectives on this. Is it acceptable elsewhere to leave your small child alone in the car for 5 minutes while you get something from a store? Would you fear for the child's safety, of legal action, or neither? Is the US leading the way criminalizing parents who do such things, or are there other countries that have been doing this for years?

What happened in the article was just plain crazy. I'm from Finland and being five minutes somewhere outside the car -- nobody would blink an eye.

But things would also escalate gradually, depending on the situation. People would gather and start looking at the clock, seeing how the baby is doing and how long he's been there.

I'm sure there are laws you eventually do break if you leave your baby in the car for a long period of time (half an hour and up?), or in a hot parking lot and windows too closed.

Somebody would call the authorities and the police/firemen would break the window and save the baby and stay waiting for the parent: this would certainly warrant at least hectic reporting. The social workers would probably be notified and there would be a couple of meetings to figure out what's the deal.

But somebody being away for a few minutes... No way it would ever be a criminal case or brought to the judge or courts. While Finland does love rules and regulations more than sanefully necessary, you still have to mess up pretty bad to actually get charged for anything.

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