It seems like anything I do is never good enough. I can know how to code in multiple languages and provide decent coding examples. But, there is always one little thing that I didn't have in order to get the job. It feels like job postings are not very honest at what they are looking for either. An example would be of a 'Frontend Engineer' job posting that I got an email response back from the hiring manager for, and he asked for a link to a fully functioning and non-trivial web app that I had built before. Wtf? I have not built that as of now (even though I am confident I could). And it would not have been in the companies preferred stack anyways. I just want to know one thing: WTF do hiring managers actually want? And why do they almost never seem know themselves? Sorry for the rant but it just seems like this industry is a load of bullshit.
Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
1–10 of 23 posts
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#2A lot of job listings are actually for internal candidates, and although the employer is required by law to perform interviews, the external candidate will never get the job over the internal candidate (since the external candidate is a higher risk). What hiring managers actually want is a candidate that has been personally vouched for by developers they trust, and ideally an internship or contract period at a lower pay rate so that they can pull out if the candidate isn't as good as they say they are.
So, make friends with people who have jobs in the industry and convince them that you have the necessary skills.
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#3get a open source contrib on your resume - something they will recognize by name, and hopefully quote something cool - "sped up rendering by 99%"
get a good past job that they will recognize the employer name
and you will have an easy time.
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#4A lot of job listings are actually for internal candidates, and although the employer is required by law to perform interviews, the external candidate will never get the job over the internal candidate (since the external candidate is a higher risk). What hiring managers actually want is a candidate that has been personally vouched for by developers they trust, and ideally an internship or contract period at a lower…
This is honestly not much better than nepotism. What happened to merit?
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#5A lot of job listings are actually for internal candidates, and although the employer is required by law to perform interviews, the external candidate will never get the job over the internal candidate (since the external candidate is a higher risk). What hiring managers actually want is a candidate that has been personally vouched for by developers they trust, and ideally an internship or contract period at a lower…
This is honestly not much better than nepotism. What happened to merit?
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Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#6https://medium.com/@mikeleeorg/how-to-find-great-software-de...
i guess this would help to some extent
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#7A lot of job listings are actually for internal candidates, and although the employer is required by law to perform interviews, the external candidate will never get the job over the internal candidate (since the external candidate is a higher risk). What hiring managers actually want is a candidate that has been personally vouched for by developers they trust, and ideally an internship or contract period at a lower…
This is honestly not much better than nepotism. What happened to merit?
What happened to merit is that "make friends in the industry and convince them you have the skills" is a more reliable means of finding merit than a typical interview process. It also has tremendous blind spots and will exclude many legitimate candidates in an unequal way and that all sucks, but the goal is "find someone reliably competent you can work with." It's really hard to determine either of those without long term interaction.
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#8Most important is to keep looking, and not let the search get you down (which is hard, for sure). Remember that looking for work is a full-time job.
My current position I found through a connection, and that doubtless helped, but I've gotten jobs before through responding to university postings and craigslist ads. I've also been turned down at plenty of places that I've found both ways - for any given position, most of the time you won't get it (of course, since there are going to be multiple candidates).
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#9"there is always one little thing that I didn't have in order to get the job"
I hear you. Many times, it is not even you. Like you said, the hiring manager is probably too hung up on one specific item that they really think will hit the home run. Now, that depends on the situation. If they need an expert in a very specific niche for a 1 month contract, they probably care about that one thing. If they are looking to hire someone fulltime who can grow in the company, being hung up on that one thing is plain stupid.
"WTF do hiring managers actually want? "
I have been interviewed by tons of managers being a consultant. I would say majority of them are not always sure what exactly they want. It can change. For example, I interviewed once for a role which required a very specific vendor system experience in finance. Apparently, that system was so niche and new that they could not find anyone unless they poached from the vendor directly. So the manager decided to look at other "relevant" candidates. The problem: He had no clue what to look for. True story.
So don't get too upset about this. I say move on and keep looking. There are many great hiring mangers out there who not only understand what they want/need, they also know how to interview and find the right person without being too hung up on one thing or other.
Re: Ask HN: How do you *really* get a good Software Engineering job?
#10A lot of job listings are actually for internal candidates, and although the employer is required by law to perform interviews, the external candidate will never get the job over the internal candidate (since the external candidate is a higher risk). What hiring managers actually want is a candidate that has been personally vouched for by developers they trust, and ideally an internship or contract period at a lower…
This is honestly not much better than nepotism. What happened to merit?
Only one of my jobs did I get in the door because of a connection. My other jobs were just all responding to job ads. I think the key is for you to filter job ads extensively yourself and only apply to jobs that: (1) you're passionate about and (2) are completely qualified for. Then write a great cover letter and a resume just for that job.