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Fitness Crazed

nytimes.com

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Re: Fitness Crazed

#51

Post by jere »

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #45

I have trouble understanding the basis for articles like these. As far as it goes, asking which exercises might provide the best real-world gains is a sensible question, but the question of why a 40 yr old man wants to be able to push 235 lbs away from his chest when lying reclined is never even asked. Does he know why he wants this? From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal…

>From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal to potential mates that he is worthy of reproduction

You've made a lot of assumptions about his motivations. In Starting Strength, Rippetoe basically makes the claim that these exercises are the most effective way to improve someone's overall health and fitness. His attitude is probably best summarized by the following quote:

>Humans are not physically normal in the absence of hard physical effort.

Now, I'm not going to argue with you about whether humans need exercise to be healthy or if so, which kinds. But for the people who do come to that conclusion (that apparently includes the author), there's plenty of motivation beyond attracting mates.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#52

Post by jqm »

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #45

I have trouble understanding the basis for articles like these. As far as it goes, asking which exercises might provide the best real-world gains is a sensible question, but the question of why a 40 yr old man wants to be able to push 235 lbs away from his chest when lying reclined is never even asked. Does he know why he wants this? From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal…

"A male's ability to provide benefit to a female just doesn't lean much towards the "fighting off sabertooth tigers" anymore, nor even in the western world towards "fighting off other males"

Yes, you are exactly right. And the brain knows that. Yet, our evolutionary selection criteria, eh....let's just call it what it is... the desire of people to have sex with you, hasn't caught up yet. There is a reason big breasts and biceps arouse desire when they logically shouldn't.

And this primitive holdover alone is good enough reason for some people to try to gain sexually desirable (although admittedly kind of stupid from a practical perspective) traits.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#53

Post by morgante »

jcfrei wrote: post #50
NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #45

I have trouble understanding the basis for articles like these. As far as it goes, asking which exercises might provide the best real-world gains is a sensible question, but the question of why a 40 yr old man wants to be able to push 235 lbs away from his chest when lying reclined is never even asked. Does he know why he wants this? From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal…

Here are some papers (stuck behind a paywall, but conclusions are there), which show a correlation between mortality and strength. So regardless of the author's intentions, increasing your strength might actually increase your life expectancy. http://www.bmj.com/content/337/bmj.a439 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17398228 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10795731 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16456196 PS:…

> PS: Obviously the question of causality remains contested. Are healthier people just stronger or do stronger people get healthier?

That seems like a pretty big confounding variable. Fit people are generally both healthier and stronger. I highly doubt strength training, in itself, is the most effective way to increase longevity.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#54

Post by KyleBrandt »

The first few chapters Rippetoe's "Practical Programming for Strength Training" explain a lot of the theory behind strength training.

One of the first things it does it clarify the difference between exercise vs training. Exercise is just "working out", whereas "training" is a long term plan to improve certain aspects of the body's ability.

Unless you are specific about what your goals of changing your body and your body's abilities are, then it will be hard to get "results" since "results" is not well defined.

Some example results:

   * Get bigger chest and arm muscles
   * Be able to run long distances
   * Be able to perform certain feats of strength: Lift heavy things, do certain gymnastics poses
   * Have certain muscles or muscle groups be defined
   * Any sport specific activity: climbing, rowing, golf, basketball, etc
Muscle composition and neurological response develop differently to different training. Endurance, balance, speed, range of motion, and lifting heaving things are all different. And you can develop those abilities in different muscles and movements.

Applying this context to any fitness article I read has clarified a lot for me.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#55

Post by tpeng »

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #45

I have trouble understanding the basis for articles like these. As far as it goes, asking which exercises might provide the best real-world gains is a sensible question, but the question of why a 40 yr old man wants to be able to push 235 lbs away from his chest when lying reclined is never even asked. Does he know why he wants this? From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal…

Accomplishment is a key component of happiness, and while specific strength goals may seem arbitrary, so are countless other goals and hobbies that people have. Overcoming a difficult challenge through hard work and determination can be its own reward.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#56

Post by will_work4tears »

x0x0 wrote: post #38
crazygringo wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who started with Starting Strength about a year ago, and who goes to a gym in Manhattan with lots of trainers around... Nope. The book is far superior to any of the trainers I've encountered. The book has so much detail on each exercise, it will take you weeks to absorb it, but if you read relevant parts before/after each workout, to make sure you're doing everything right, you'll probably wind up with muc…

As someone who started lifting a year ago: you don't know what you're talking about, but don't let that stop you from giving others advice that could hurt them. For the rest of people interested in getting strong: get a competent trainer (one easy evaluation metric is, as I mentioned, their deadlift maxes; greater than 500 pounds makes avoiding injury w/o good form very unlikely; or participation in powerlifting even…

Well, my max deadlift comes pretty close to 500lbs and I have been lifting for far longer than a mere year and I'm sorry to say that you are wrong.

You don't need to go to a trainer. I learned everything I know from reading, watching videos and having my form critiqued. It's actually better to go to a good powerlifting gym and make friends with some strong people, but you don't NEED to. At least not until you get to pretty elite levels.

In fact, going to a the typical trainer at the gym is a waste of money, effort, and is MORE likely to get you hurt (like rhabdomyolysis for instance). Half of those guys will just have you balance on a bosu ball while doing some arbitrary movement, and rake in your hundred+ dollars an hour. You might go home more sore than a 30 minute lifting session, but you effectively wasted your time, and probably simply decreased the likelyhood you'll even go back.

No, lifting weights isn't some magical or super technical thing (unless you are doing Olympic lifting, then, then I'd suggest getting a coach, not a trainer).

Edit: FWIW, if you can find a trainer that can DL 500lbs that is at a regular gym, I'd be liable to eat my hat. Now show me that same trainer that actually trains his clients with a routine for beginners as good or better than Starting Strength, and I'll eat my hat without ketchup.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#59

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

jere wrote: post #51
NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #45

I have trouble understanding the basis for articles like these. As far as it goes, asking which exercises might provide the best real-world gains is a sensible question, but the question of why a 40 yr old man wants to be able to push 235 lbs away from his chest when lying reclined is never even asked. Does he know why he wants this? From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal…

>From a biological perspective, a specimen might want to be able to do this to signal to potential mates that he is worthy of reproduction You've made a lot of assumptions about his motivations. In Starting Strength , Rippetoe basically makes the claim that these exercises are the most effective way to improve someone's overall health and fitness. His attitude is probably best summarized by the following quote: >Huma…

> that these exercises are the most effective way to improve someone's overall health and fitness.

This doesn't explain anything, however. It's tautological... he wants to increase his fitness, to increase his fitness?

> Now, I'm not going to argue with you about whether humans need exercise to be healthy or if so,

To what end? To eke out another 3 years at the end of his life, probably in a nursing home?

If he was trying to avoid diabetes, that makes sense to me, that affects anywhere from 10-40 years of your life, and is a very extreme quality-of-life factor.

This doesn't explain the ever-present fitness craze.

Re: Fitness Crazed

#60

Post by jwallaceparker »

This new workout book from Joe Manganiello (actor from True Blood) is pretty incredible.

http://www.amazon.com/Evolution-Cutting-Breaking-Mental-Buil...

He details the workout he used to transform his body for his role of Alcide (a werewolf) on True Blood.

There are also a few chapters dedicated to motivation and mental approach. They're well-written and he doesn't pull any punches. Highly recommended.

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