"JavaScript web frameworks seem to have a half-life of about 6 months..."
Express [1] has been the dominant framework for Node.js since 2009-2010. What frameworks are you talking about?
Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
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Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#22Looking from the top of todays technology some can observe subtle transition from desktop to mobile to wearable electronics (intelligent clothes). From this point of view Web becomes obsolete. Everyone prefers native apps on mobiles. Honestly I can't see bright future for Web in wearable electronics world now. I'm almost 100% sure there won't be HTML inside.
Web was designed with desktop in mind. The further form desktop the less Web. The future is not on desktop. C forever? Low memory footprint and small executables are still there.
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#23If you are still considering PHP frameworks, then your choices are really Symfony or Laravel (maybe Zend at a stretch).
Yes, Laravel does have a high "bus factor", but for me personally its the number one choice in terms of ecosystem, features, support and community,
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#24To me, the most interesting thing about this post is that there is no clear answer. We're mired in, frankly, a lot of junk. There's no winner because nothing is really very good.
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#25I'm also a bit frustrated with the Yii situation, although I do understand why they're doing it. Yii 2.0 is a total rewrite, and it is technically very impressive. However they have had the disadvantage of not being able to ship until it reaches feature parity with 1.1 which has been a huge undertaking. The lead developer, Qiang, is literally the second most active developer on github[0], so it's not like they're not…
Kohana has died as far as I'm concerned. Such a shame, but it was a great replacement for CodeIgniter back in the day. CakePHP tried to hard to be Rails and messed it up, and I've never forgiven it, and it was horribly slow in my benchmarking. Out of PHP frameworks, I would rule out anything that doesn't use Composer. If you can't use the best bit of tooling PHP has gained lately (other than HHVM) and are stuck copyi…
400kloc on Laravel, holy shit snacks what the hell does it do?
I just cloc'd my projects root and including laravel and some dependencies (/vendor) that's 295,000loc).
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#26The other consideration needs to be "How did this mature framework evolve?". Symfony dumped all symfony1 users up s * creek when Symfony2 came out; Zend framework 2 is an entirely different beast to ZF1... Are these mature frameworks any more stable than the new ones, or are they new frameworks, phoenix-like in assuming the name of the old one?
As far as those two frameworks, it's mostly about retaining brand recognition.
On the other hand, major version releases are when you make such dramatic departures from what's come before. At least in ZF, they got a lot a lot of things more-right.
I moved a (pretty complex, line-of-business transactional-type) project from ZF1 -> ZF2, and I'm happy I did. Some things changed a lot (dispatch, routing, forms), while other things were very easy to translate (caching, logging, etc).
In that case, most of the business logic was built around Doctrine2, encapsulated nicely into service classes, and therefore fairly framework-agnostic.
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#27Interesting views on Python - I decided to start using it for personal projects after trying Go for a bit. Initially I hated the significant whitespace, and indeed many other things, but I stuck with it and I find it all rather elegant - I certainly haven't noticed any huge problems with dependencies but I've probably stuck with pretty mainstream ones (e.g. Requests).
I now rather like significant whitespace and often find myself considering that my ideal language would probably be half way between Python and Lisp.
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#28Dropwizard is where it's at right now for Java frameworks. It's a superproject that glues together the best pieces out there. Surprised it wasn't on the wikipedia list. Which brings up another point: if we're talking about web frameworks for the next decade we should really be looking at service-oriented architectures / single-page apps or whatever you want to call that model. It's quite different from the web framew…
>Dropwizard can do web views but it really positions itself as a REST service framework. That would eliminate it for me. Not everyone is coding APIs and fat client web apps. I'd prefer a framework geared up to do standard web apps as well.
That may be what you want right now but the article is about something that will last 10 years. And what constitutes a "standard web app" is definitely shifting and will likely solidify over that time. "Fat client" isn't really the best term for it, because the client code is usually pretty lightweight. I'd say "modern web app".
I'd be including a consideration of AngularJS, Backbone, Ember etc. + a service-oriented backend framework like Dropwizard. That's also incidentally how you'd architect your backend support a native mobile client, which is a good thing to prepare for even if you think you only need an HTML frontend right now.
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#29Not sure what kind of applications he expects to build, but picking a "Web" Framework for the next decade should probably also include a Javascript framework that allows more app-y websites. Clients are already falling for those.
Re: Choosing a Web Framework/Language Combo for the Next Decade
#30I'm very curious how the Google searches were done. I get 2.5 million results for "ruby sinatra" on Google vs. 5160 in the article. The numbers I get for "ruby rails" are similarly much higher. So clearly he must be searching for something else. Even "ruby sinatra framework" gets 388,000 for me.