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The desktop and the developer

mjg59.dreamwidth.org

81–90 of 304 posts

Re: The desktop and the developer

#81
post #8

I had been using Linux for years before finally buying a rMBP -- and it took another four months to install Windows 8.1 on it. Any OS has it's problems, and the question is how easy it is to overcome them. Windows does not have a nice console interface, but everything else is fast and frictionless, there are practically no driver problems, etc. I can more ore less work around the lack of proper console (learning Powe…

cannot make my own Google Drive or OneDrive client

Could you elaborate on this please? "can't" as in "it's too much work" or "can't" as in "impossible for some technical reason".

Re: The desktop and the developer

#82
I have pretty much the same opinion as the OP. Linux is in dire need of a DE that is at least on par with its internals. What strikes me is that what's good about linux structure essentially pre-dates it. I wonder if the open-source community is up to the task of making a breakthrough in this space. I'd love to see a large scale DE project take shape around, maybe, a metaphor or a concept that puts linux in reach for casual users while still pleasing developers alike. I'm pretty sure high profiles in the UX and dev communities would happily embark on the project and give off some of their time.

Re: The desktop and the developer

#83
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A HTML5 based graphical shell based on ChromiumOS/FirefoxOS could be the solution for Linux desktop . KDE 1-3 and Gnome 1 were a good desktop environment. I don't get why some devs prefer to rewrite good things. KDE 4 and Gnome 3 hurt the Linux desktop and users are searching for alternatives ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KDE_4#Reception , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNOME_2#GNOME_3 )

I don't agree that the later KDE and Gnome releases where steps backwards, in fact I think they've made solid progress towards matching OSX and Windows in terms of ease-of-use. On the other hand, this could be exactly the problem. It does seem that the more the Linux environments pursue the same goals as OSX and Windows, the stronger the backlash.

more the Linux environments pursue the same goals as OSX and Windows, the stronger the backlash

Indeed - people want an alternative, not just a replication with a different license.

Re: The desktop and the developer

#84
post #65
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I use a macbook, but agree with you. Unfortunately as a piece of hardware it seems to me virtually unrivalled, the latest internal components are available to new machines promptly, they have great displays with loads of real estate, long battery life, very good manufacturer support and the 13" is a superb, thin form factor for travelling with. I run a cluster of Linux VMs on it using vagrant so it's just my browser,…

http://shop.lenovo.com/us/en/laptops/lenovo/yoga-laptop-seri...

- Are you claiming that this machine will run Linux well? If so, you're missing links to back that claim.

- Are you claiming that the specs match a 13" MacBook? If so, you must realize that it's possible to have a poor experience even with the same technical specs.

- I haven't heard good things about Lenovo's non-ThinkPad laptops. Has this changed recently? Do you have something (a review perhaps) to backup the idea that anyone should seriously entertain this laptop as a legitimate choice?

Re: The desktop and the developer

#85
post #39

I use Windows 7 to write for Linux. The real story here is that even developers don't want to write code in Linux for Linux.

I'm on Windows 7 and use a Linux VM, where I actually do all the development. I love the command line, but still haven't found a Linux GUI I'm as comfortable in as Windows. Ubuntu was getting close there for a while, but then they went to Unity, which I tried to like, but ended up pretty much loathing.

I think you must try Cinnamon [http://cinnamon.linuxmint.com/]

Re: The desktop and the developer

#86
Two big reasons I think Mac OSX is so popular with devs: 1.) There are better graphical tools/apps available for OSX then any other OS. Kaldeoscope, Tower, SourceTree(also for windows), Atom(coming soon to other platforms), iTunes, many more games available for down time, evernote client, tweetbot, sequel pro, pattern, and imessage are just some of the better apps that are aren't available or have poor alternates on other OSes. 2.) A rMBP is the best machine available if you want to develop mobile apps. It's one machine that allows you to build an app for any mobile device out there.

Re: The desktop and the developer

#87

I've used OS X at work for the past 2 years and I completely disagree that OS X is nice for developers. I've had a lot of issues that I wouldn't have had if I was using a GNU/Linux distro like Debian. Major issues with GCC after certain updates, outdated GNU software like bash, brew is barely acceptable as a package manager (can't hold a candle to dpkg/apt), and I have to go to websites to get the installers for most…

Totally agree. I've got a Macbook Air (OSX Mavericks) and a (Lenovo)Thinkpad (Arch Linux). I'd add to your points that it's not only a software issue, but also a hardware issue. Recently I've found myself tweaking the trackpoint settings and have gone so far as modifying the driver and the syndaemon utility just to be able to get a better user experience.

When it comes to Apple's hardware/software combination, I'm sometimes surprised by how Linux compares really poorly in my experience. Weight and form factor aside, the trackpad on my Thinkpad is awful. Really god damned awful. And I wouldn't usually complain much about that, but the other fact is that the TrackPoint nipple is probably equally as bad in build quality and when you move the pointer a bit, it seems to get stuck and continues to move your pointer until you rub that nipple left or right. The sensitivity of the TrackPad however, is a disgrace, and the minimum jump seems to be something like 10 pixels, on a 12.5" screen. That's very choppy.

So: when I'm on my Macbook, I miss the trackpoint. When I'm on my Lenovo, I miss the Mac's multitouch trackpad, and a better trackpoint.

Software will improve the experience, but better hardware has to come with that, in general. When it comes down to it, the best quality you'll get out of your money will probably come from a Macbook (throwing in the form factor if it's to your taste, which adds points), so developers end up going for the better hardware, the better user experience, and hey, it happens to come with OSX, which without much effort has this really usable development environment, unix utilities, etc. Good enough, I'd say, given what the alternative usually is. And I still develop on Linux most of the time.

Re: The desktop and the developer

#88
post #29

I've used OS X at work for the past 2 years and I completely disagree that OS X is nice for developers. I've had a lot of issues that I wouldn't have had if I was using a GNU/Linux distro like Debian. Major issues with GCC after certain updates, outdated GNU software like bash, brew is barely acceptable as a package manager (can't hold a candle to dpkg/apt), and I have to go to websites to get the installers for most…

I only used Linux for a short while and that was when Ubuntu Unity was a very new thing, so I assume it got better now, but then it couldn't possibly compare to OSX virtual desktops; it was usable, but very annoying. Having said that, I need a terminal (iTerm2), a browser, and a packet manager (homebrew), and I'm happy. I assume build issues would happen on Linux too, and they would probably be harder to resolve (mor…

> I assume build issues would happen on Linux too, and they would probably be harder to resolve (more versions of the OS).

That's a fairly large assumption to make based on your admitted lack of experience.

Re: The desktop and the developer

#89

I've used OS X at work for the past 2 years and I completely disagree that OS X is nice for developers. I've had a lot of issues that I wouldn't have had if I was using a GNU/Linux distro like Debian. Major issues with GCC after certain updates, outdated GNU software like bash, brew is barely acceptable as a package manager (can't hold a candle to dpkg/apt), and I have to go to websites to get the installers for most…

I've used Linux, Windows and OS X. I don't consider OS X to be a development environment for serious development. I do consider Linux and Windows to be real dev tools.

> I don't consider OS X to be a development environment for serious development.

You are indirectly saying that people doing development on OSX are not 'serious developers' or at least are not doing 'serious development.'

[ What is the difference between 'serious development' and regular development anyways? I'm pretty sure that Apple employees aren't developing iOS and OSX on Windows or Linux. Do you not consider systems-level (building an operating system) development to be 'serious'? ]

Re: The desktop and the developer

#90
post #53

Missing a killer feature here, at least for me: High-DPI support. No environment on Linux deals with high-DPI adequately yet. Between that and the other big one mentioned in the article, multitouch trackpad support, there is simply no way I can compromise. There isn't really anything else tying me down to OS X, but those two are huge. They're the only major changes I've seen in my workflow and desktop experience in t…

OSX doesn't have HighDPI support. They just scale everything and present a lower resolution. Go ahead and actually try to user a high resolution on your Macbook. I know I did and then I tried to set things to autoscale ( like gnome 3 will do right out of the box ) since most of the time I only want a few applications with lots of screen real estate and I want the others to have larger font. I gave up and just run OSX at the lower resolution and save the high pixel count for when I am in Linux.
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