Hoodie – Fast web app development • Hacker News Board

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#31

Post by EGreg » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:09 PM UTC

sergiotapia wrote: post #13

>It took less than 15 minutes for a person with no experience in any part of the stack to take an existing single user app and make it a multi-user application with robust security and data storage. […] Bravo, hood.ie, brav-fucking-o. I find that extremely hard to believe.

You should try to head to http://github.com/EGreg/Q and try it out :)

I think you'll find that you can make a multiuser app from a single user app rather straightforwardly in a day. Although 15 mins would be only for a Q expert.

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#32

Post by josephjrobison » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:12 PM UTC

Just realized .ie is an excellent TLD for cute website names

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#33

Post by Brakenshire » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:13 PM UTC

janl wrote: post #8

Team Hoodie here. Happy to answer any questions you might have :)

Apologies for asking such a horrible question, but is there a rough timeline for it being production ready? It looks very interesting.

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#34

Post by leorocky » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:15 PM UTC

billyhoffman wrote: post #20

So let's just deliver all our business logic as JavaScript to an entirely untrustworthy client! Whats the worst that could happen?

Desktop clients have been delivering business logic to clients for a very long time with few problems. Web powered apps are similar. The issues involve protecting data stored in the cloud, communicating over secure channels and client security. JavaScript powered applications running in a browser have many security considerations, but they're manageable if you have security aware engineers building your application. Knowing about OWASP[1] helps.

[1] https://www.owasp.org/index.php/Main_Page

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#35

Post by joshfraser » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:18 PM UTC

billyhoffman wrote: post #20

So let's just deliver all our business logic as JavaScript to an entirely untrustworthy client! Whats the worst that could happen?

Sharing the business logic is less of an issue than the business metrics that get leaked when you include user ID's in your source code.

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#36

Post by dasil003 » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:19 PM UTC

janl wrote: post #27

billyhoffman wrote: post #20

So let's just deliver all our business logic as JavaScript to an entirely untrustworthy client! Whats the worst that could happen?

Hoodie works no different than Gmail. What’s the worst that can happen there?

How is one of the first apps to popularize AJAX, developed on top of a proprietary cross-compiling framework by a top-3 web giant "no different" from Hoodie? Obviously you're getting at some specific point that is completely obscured by the ridiculousness of the comparison. Hopefully it's more than "client-side logic can be useful" because that much is obvious on its face. It's also obvious that the idealized promise of no-backend falls apart pretty quickly for a majority of real world apps. So what is your point exactly?

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#37

Post by billyhoffman » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:20 PM UTC

janl wrote: post #27

billyhoffman wrote: post #20

So let's just deliver all our business logic as JavaScript to an entirely untrustworthy client! Whats the worst that could happen?

Hoodie works no different than Gmail. What’s the worst that can happen there?

Well you sure as shit aren't going to see "hoodie.account.signUp(username, password);" in Gmail's client-side code.

Gmail's code base is not a "offline first, mobile first" platform. The API that is exposed to the client-side is fairly light (watch the traffic).

I highly suggest use research "business logic flaws" in web apps. Anything Jeremiah Grossman has said on this topic is good stuff.

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#38

Post by janl » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:21 PM UTC

dasil003 wrote: post #36

janl wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hoodie works no different than Gmail. What’s the worst that can happen there?

How is one of the first apps to popularize AJAX, developed on top of a proprietary cross-compiling framework by a top-3 web giant "no different" from Hoodie? Obviously you're getting at some specific point that is completely obscured by the ridiculousness of the comparison. Hopefully it's more than "client-side logic can be useful" because that much is obvious on its face. It's also obvious that the idealized promise…

Sorry, from “delivering business logic to the client” perspective, Hoodie is no different in concept on that angle. Lots of things are very different, of course :)

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#39

Post by jjr2527 » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:22 PM UTC

janl wrote: post #8

Team Hoodie here. Happy to answer any questions you might have :)

Is it just me or are there some dependency management issues?

Missing boom, shot, now lru-cache...down the rabbit hole.

Re: Hoodie – Fast web app development

#40

Post by janl » Mon, May 19, 2014, 5:25 PM UTC

billyhoffman wrote: post #37

janl wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hoodie works no different than Gmail. What’s the worst that can happen there?

Well you sure as shit aren't going to see "hoodie.account.signUp(username, password);" in Gmail's client-side code. Gmail's code base is not a "offline first, mobile first" platform. The API that is exposed to the client-side is fairly light (watch the traffic). I highly suggest use research "business logic flaws" in web apps. Anything Jeremiah Grossman has said on this topic is good stuff.

They have frontend code that will talk to /singup or whatever the route for creating an account is. Hoodie does nothing different.

Thanks for the pointer to Jeremiah, though :)