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Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

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Re: Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

#61

Post by TuringTest »

mikeash wrote: post #60
TuringTest wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(Ironically, web apps are an area where you can generally get away with not knowing anything about open source licenses, since you're not redistributing the programs you make.) Except if you happen to use something under an Affero GPL license, in which case you really should know about it. But yes, those project are rare.

I hadn't heard of that one. Is it actually enforceable? I was under the impression that the GPL didn't require opening server code, not because it was missing something, but because server code doesn't get distributed and thus doesn't fall under copyright limitations in the first place.

The Affero GPL is a modificated version of the common GPL that explicitly handles the case of software used as a service through internet.

It's fairly uncommon, but those projects licensed with this version have specific function built in that allows any user to get a copy of the source code (and you couldn't remove it without breaching the license); and some known names use it (MediaGoblin, MongoDB, Diaspora, Ghostscript, Launchpad, POV-Ray are some examples).

Re: Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

#62

Post by blueskin_ »

TuringTest wrote: post #56
aliakbarkhan wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would appreciate some more detail, too. I've noticed that I find TVT much less engrossing than I did a few years ago, but I thought I'd just grown out of it. If there's an explanation for the decline I would be very interested to hear it. edit: How accurate is the Encyclopedia Dramatica article on TVT? I normally avoid ED, but I gave in this time because it seems to be pretty comprehensive. edit 2: I found this blo…

I made the same questions when I discovered All The Tropes, these are the most relevant links I found: * The Google Incident [1] explains first-hand why TV Tropes adopted tighter guidelines against sexual fan fiction, from which several forks were created as reaction. * The fork All The Tropes explains how they are different[2], and why they made the fork [3]. * This recent discussion at MetaFilter have lots of detai…

How does a site like tvtropes need thousands per month? they must be doing something wrong...

Stick it on a few linode or AWS VPSes and add some backend code to bring in new ones as load goes up, maybe with physical servers for database backend. Switch to nginx if it doesn't use it already (can't remember (edit: yep, using Apache; also seems to only be on a single IP, hosted by ServerBeach)), add memcached, perhaps put the whole thing behind cloudflare, and problem solved.

Re: Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

#63

Post by Flimm »

mikeash wrote: post #60
TuringTest wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(Ironically, web apps are an area where you can generally get away with not knowing anything about open source licenses, since you're not redistributing the programs you make.) Except if you happen to use something under an Affero GPL license, in which case you really should know about it. But yes, those project are rare.

I hadn't heard of that one. Is it actually enforceable? I was under the impression that the GPL didn't require opening server code, not because it was missing something, but because server code doesn't get distributed and thus doesn't fall under copyright limitations in the first place.

You find a library on the Internet somewhere. What entitles you to copy it onto your machines? Copyright does not allow to do this, so you are reliant on a license to give you permission to do this. GPL gives you permission to do this, as long as when you distribute any modifications of it, you also pass along the source code. AGPL gives you permission to do this, as long as you give the source code to all of your users should they request it. If you can't meet the conditions, than you don't get the rights acquired by the license, and you fall back to default copyright, which says it's illegal to have copied the library to your own machines in the first place.

Re: Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

#64

Post by belorn »

mikeash wrote: post #60
TuringTest wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(Ironically, web apps are an area where you can generally get away with not knowing anything about open source licenses, since you're not redistributing the programs you make.) Except if you happen to use something under an Affero GPL license, in which case you really should know about it. But yes, those project are rare.

I hadn't heard of that one. Is it actually enforceable? I was under the impression that the GPL didn't require opening server code, not because it was missing something, but because server code doesn't get distributed and thus doesn't fall under copyright limitations in the first place.

AGPL enforceability (under copyright) rests on the concept of modification rights. The basic idea is that one must get copyright permission in order to modify a protected work, which then AGPL adds conditions for.

This has been semi-tested in the past. In a court case regarding sold paintings, the court sided with the painter when the buyer wanted to chop the art into pieces and rearrange them. The court decided that the act of modifying the art created an derivative work which the painter had not given the buyer permission for.

Re: Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

#65

Post by labster »

blueskin_ wrote: post #62
TuringTest wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I made the same questions when I discovered All The Tropes, these are the most relevant links I found: * The Google Incident [1] explains first-hand why TV Tropes adopted tighter guidelines against sexual fan fiction, from which several forks were created as reaction. * The fork All The Tropes explains how they are different[2], and why they made the fork [3]. * This recent discussion at MetaFilter have lots of detai…

How does a site like tvtropes need thousands per month? they must be doing something wrong... Stick it on a few linode or AWS VPSes and add some backend code to bring in new ones as load goes up, maybe with physical servers for database backend. Switch to nginx if it doesn't use it already (can't remember (edit: yep, using Apache; also seems to only be on a single IP, hosted by ServerBeach)), add memcached, perhaps p…

You say "add memcached" like it's easy to do on 10 year old wiki software. TVT is running a highly custom Pmwiki install, with no upstream updates in a long time. The something wrong isn't the hosting costs, so much as the sole developer/owner/admin running the site.

I'll also note that the forums make up most of the traffic of the site, and that's the one place you can turn off adverts for free. The wiki supports the core product, which is apparently the forums.

Re: Edge of the Creative Commons (2013)

#66

Post by blueskin_ »

labster wrote: post #65
blueskin_ wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does a site like tvtropes need thousands per month? they must be doing something wrong... Stick it on a few linode or AWS VPSes and add some backend code to bring in new ones as load goes up, maybe with physical servers for database backend. Switch to nginx if it doesn't use it already (can't remember (edit: yep, using Apache; also seems to only be on a single IP, hosted by ServerBeach)), add memcached, perhaps p…

You say "add memcached" like it's easy to do on 10 year old wiki software. TVT is running a highly custom Pmwiki install, with no upstream updates in a long time. The something wrong isn't the hosting costs, so much as the sole developer/owner/admin running the site. I'll also note that the forums make up most of the traffic of the site, and that's the one place you can turn off adverts for free. The wiki supports th…

If I was an admin there, I'd probably have made upgrading to some new software (that actually supports special characters etc. in titles, doesn't drop edit history off the end of the page into /dev/null, doesn't have the weirdest way of creating links I've seen, etc.) a key priority.
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