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How extreme isolation warps the mind

bbc.com

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Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#71

Post by jqm »

biot wrote: post #64
jqm wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Stupid comments might tend to be short. But all short comments are not stupid. Sometimes it is possible to say much with humor in very few words. Thank you for providing a guys opinion. But I don't happen to be religious.

> Sometimes it is possible to say much with humor in very few words. I completely agree with that, though I disagree that you said much in your original comment (or that it was funny) which is why I think that your subsequent comment explaining what you meant would have been better to start with. Your original comment mentioned nothing about working remotely in isolation or less severe version of the symptoms, and "t…

It's been interesting to watch the votes on the original comment over the past couple of hours.

It has received no less than 10 votes with a fairly even split and a slight favor towards the positive. Some people apparently feel exactly what I'm talking about. Some don't.

I think maybe we are seeing breakdown of people who have put in serious alone time with an editor VS those who have not. I could be wrong about this. But I don't feel the need to explain. You understand or you don't.

I'm sorry if the comment caused you consternation. Please be assured this was not my intention.

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#72

Post by at-fates-hands »

delluminatus wrote: post #5

A psychological gem was dropped in the middle of the article: People in her circumstances have their world suddenly inverted, and there is nothing in the manner of their taking – no narrative of sacrifice, or enduring for a greater good – to help them derive meaning from it. They must somehow find meaning in their predicament – or mentally detach themselves from their day-to-day reality, which is a monumental task wh…

I've had several members of my family go through addiction and have dealt with clinical depression. I gave Frankl's book to one of my older sisters and it had a profound impact on her. It was no silver bullet to her recovery, but it made her look at life completely differently.

Also, in the movie, "I Am Legend" you can see what happens when we're deprived of interaction with other human beings. Will Smith's character goes through seemingly humorous interactions with mannequins in the video store at the beginning of the movie. Although people were snickering in the movie theater, it occurred to me that he was simply trying to create meaning for his own life, even if in some nonsensical way, to avoid going crazy because there were no more "humans" to interact with. It was a constant theme throughout the movie and I'm not sure too many people got that.

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#73

Post by v3rt »

3rd3 wrote: post #69
delluminatus wrote: post #5

A psychological gem was dropped in the middle of the article: People in her circumstances have their world suddenly inverted, and there is nothing in the manner of their taking – no narrative of sacrifice, or enduring for a greater good – to help them derive meaning from it. They must somehow find meaning in their predicament – or mentally detach themselves from their day-to-day reality, which is a monumental task wh…

I cannot understand why people still decide to base their motivations on slippery concepts like the meaning of life or on some romantized, conjectured intrinsic values of our species. It seems to me that there are much better mental models of our existence that can help us to organize our thoughts and lifes, most notably things that are derived from the theory of evolution, neuroscience and from behavioral biology.

In this case, probably because when you're being tortured, it's small comfort to know how the synapses of your tormentors' brains are firing. Things like defiance in the face of adversity or finding meaning in life seem to be universal across cultures, and a lot more fundamental to the way our brains work than something like scientific understanding.

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#74

Post by PavlovsCat »

delluminatus wrote: post #5

A psychological gem was dropped in the middle of the article: People in her circumstances have their world suddenly inverted, and there is nothing in the manner of their taking – no narrative of sacrifice, or enduring for a greater good – to help them derive meaning from it. They must somehow find meaning in their predicament – or mentally detach themselves from their day-to-day reality, which is a monumental task wh…

Here is a bit from Robert Antelme's "L'Espèce humaine", badly translated by me from the German version ("Das Menschengeschlecht") into English:

"On Sunday we have to do something, it cannot go on like this. We have to get out of the hunger. We have to talk to the people. There are some among them who are rapidly deteriorating, they are letting themselves go, they let themselves get destroyed. There are even some among them who forgot why they are here. We have to talk with each other."

This happened in the tunnel, and was carried on from mule to mule. In this way a language started to exist, which was no longer the language of cursing or something thrown up from the stomach, and also not the barking for a cup of food. This language here created a distance between the human and the muddy, yellow earth, so that he was no longer dug into it, but its master, master even over the empty pocket of his stomach. In the pit, in the bent body, in the deformed head, the world opened."

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#75

Post by saraid216 »

3rd3 wrote: post #69
delluminatus wrote: post #5

A psychological gem was dropped in the middle of the article: People in her circumstances have their world suddenly inverted, and there is nothing in the manner of their taking – no narrative of sacrifice, or enduring for a greater good – to help them derive meaning from it. They must somehow find meaning in their predicament – or mentally detach themselves from their day-to-day reality, which is a monumental task wh…

I cannot understand why people still decide to base their motivations on slippery concepts like the meaning of life or on some romantized, conjectured intrinsic values of our species. It seems to me that there are much better mental models of our existence that can help us to organize our thoughts and lifes, most notably things that are derived from the theory of evolution, neuroscience and from behavioral biology.

Because such slippery concepts make it more possible to survive adversity. It's almost as if it was a trait selected by evolutionary pressure because those were the mental models that helped their users survive.

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#76

Post by CatMtKing »

It seems like the author's confusing two concepts here. He postulates about isolation from human contact, but all his examples are for isolation from sunlight or sensory deprivation. I don't disagree that there are connections between the two, but it doesn't feel like he jumped that gap.

Edit: Seems like the whole article is based on the author's book. So maybe it was taken a little out of context?

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#77

Post by biot »

jqm wrote: post #71
biot wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sometimes it is possible to say much with humor in very few words. I completely agree with that, though I disagree that you said much in your original comment (or that it was funny) which is why I think that your subsequent comment explaining what you meant would have been better to start with. Your original comment mentioned nothing about working remotely in isolation or less severe version of the symptoms, and "t…

It's been interesting to watch the votes on the original comment over the past couple of hours. It has received no less than 10 votes with a fairly even split and a slight favor towards the positive. Some people apparently feel exactly what I'm talking about. Some don't. I think maybe we are seeing breakdown of people who have put in serious alone time with an editor VS those who have not. I could be wrong about this…

No consternation felt here; my intent is to encourage higher quality comments. Your follow-up comment was quality as it contained relevant details your initial comment lacked.

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#78

Post by soperj »

aquadrop wrote: post #58
soperj wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tsars were in control before ww1 not ww2.

Yes, that makes the story more fascinating. They left home during revolution and actually, youngest daughter was still living there alone up until recently (2010-2011 I think).

I think you're reading the story wrong, they even talk about the Bolsheviks killing the guys brother. They would have gone into the wilderness just before WW2, years after the revolution(Based on them being there for 40 years, and being found in 78).

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#79

Post by kreeben »

jafaku wrote: post #54
septerr wrote: post #33

"Since then, researchers have found that in darkness most people eventually adjust to a 48-hour cycle: 36 hours of activity followed by 12 hours of sleep. The reasons are still unclear" This statement was interesting to me. I wonder if it resonates with anyone else on HN. My BF who works from home a lot can spend days/hours at home splitting his time between working (programming) and playing video games. He has said…

I did something similar for a couple years, I used to sleep 8-10 hours but only 6 times a week. People kept telling me that my rotating hours were bad for my body, but I was in perfect shape, ate well, exercised, etc. Eventually I came back to "normal" because of certain obligations and human interactions, but I think I'll return to my rotating hours once I'm done with that.

Get kids. Problem solved.

Re: How extreme isolation warps the mind

#80

Post by [deleted] »

v3rt wrote: post #73
3rd3 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cannot understand why people still decide to base their motivations on slippery concepts like the meaning of life or on some romantized, conjectured intrinsic values of our species. It seems to me that there are much better mental models of our existence that can help us to organize our thoughts and lifes, most notably things that are derived from the theory of evolution, neuroscience and from behavioral biology.

In this case, probably because when you're being tortured, it's small comfort to know how the synapses of your tormentors' brains are firing. Things like defiance in the face of adversity or finding meaning in life seem to be universal across cultures, and a lot more fundamental to the way our brains work than something like scientific understanding.

[deleted]
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